http://www.pinktruth.com

If you're looking for opinions on the Mary Kay business opportunity, you've come to the right place. This is our collection of opinions and stories from men and women who have visited Pink Truth, and wanted to share their Mary Kay stories.

These experiences are relayed from the perspective of the women (and their husbands, families, and friends) who were once involved with Mary Kay Cosmetics. They are stories of corruption, exploitation, and manipulation. Think that's being too dramatic? Read the stories for yourself and decide whether this "big pink monster" called Mary Kay is preying on the insecurities of women everywhere.

The Mary Kay opinions and stories have been broken down into the following groups of Mary Kay victims:

Mary Kay Sales Director Stories

Mary Kay Consultant Stories

Family and Friends of Mary Kay Women  

If you’d like your story included here, please send it to Tracy at This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it

(Note that we do edit stories for length and relevance. Names have been changed to protect the innocent. By submitting your story, you are authorizing us to post it indefinitely on Pink Truth.)

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icantbelieveit   |2009-04-19 18:04:17 omg i am so glad that i came across this...i jsut signed onto mary kay because a friend i grew up with has been trying to talk me into it. i need money being a SAHM and decided to do it...my friend lied to me telling me that inventory wasnt nessicary and then i signed on thinking that i wouldnt have to invest...then i find out that they actually told me to ask a bank for a 3,000 dollar loan to invest in inventory and we already have enough debt. at first i didnt think too much of it cause what they told me when i voiced my concern for that was well its like a grocery store you cant sell if the product isnt in the store right?... really i am glad i came across this by acident, i think that is really gods work. i am just so disapointed that i was lied to and that i really thot that i would be helping my family out! only to find it would just make it worse. my friend also told me she didnt have inventory, the SD told me oh yes she does, then i found after i signed it tells you how to recruit, all of which my friend had used on me...words cannot express the way that i feel at this moment. thank God i only signed on 4 days ago and i only bought the starter kit and a new set of clothes...family will be getting free samples!!!!

raisinberry   |2009-04-19 22:45:28 You can return your starter kit. Pack it all back in and send it on it's way. Don't be too mad at your friend...it's Mary Kay brainwashing. If she doesn't get out soon, you will see her drifting farther and farther away from you because we weren't allowed to hang with negative people. There is no better organization for manipulation than mary Kay. All objections have scripted answers..and your friend has heard and probably learned a ton already. Pray for her!

puc4now   |2009-04-20 00:56:34 Refuse to accept delivery of the starter kit. Call MK right away to cancel your agreement and stop shipment of the starter kit. If it's been shipped, don't accept it. Refuse it from the delivery man, or mark it "Return to Sender" and do NOT open it. They will not take back an opened starter kit. Good luck & post again to let us know how it went.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-20 19:28:46 oh jeeze i just signed for the things 3 hrs ago....errr wish i had checked my email before...i have NOT opened it tho...what would they do if you decided to keep the kit?...not that i am just out of curiousity...i emailed my director today and told her sorry i cant do the inventory and it doesnt seem like the best situation for me and my family, so far no phone call no email in return

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-20 19:34:06 oh and i let 3 of my friends know about this site sence one of their friends has been trying to recruit them for a couple years, needless to say they will not be joining and will be reading this website very soon!

savedbytruth   |2009-04-20 20:39:17 Don't open that box when it comes! Refuse delivery if you really don't want to have anything to do with the company. I opened my kit and wrote in the datebook (ugh!) and I'm calling corporate tomorrow to see if they'll take it back! Any seasoned vets have any advice for us?

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-20 21:36:01 well if anything they will just keep your hundred bucks right?...can they really do more than that?

puc4now   |2009-04-20 21:51:52 If you want to keep the kit, just call MK to cancel your agreement and terminate your consultant number. They keep your $100, you keep the kit. The end. But, if you open the kit and then decide you don't want it, they will not accept a return. If you want the refund, it has to be unopened. MK Repurchase Dept. told me over the phone they would not accept an opened kit.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-20 23:06:27 oh ok thx guys

The Scribbler   |2009-04-20 23:16:30 "I can't do the inventory...it doesn't seem like the best situation for me and my family." Beautiful response.  Simple, sweet, and honest.  Good for you! I tell you what - I would pay five bucks to sit in the MK phone bank for one day and count how many starter kit/inventory return calls come in. I bet it's not a small number, either.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-21 05:43:24 yea no kidding, especially right after you find out they screwed you on the rebate check. theres got to be alot that turn back in on that once they read the fine print, oh and thank you Scribbler for the compliment, i also sent her a link to the page i accidentily found here, which is the bankrupt at 27. good thing they cant hear the things my husband wants to tell them, haha

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-21 06:01:14 "Fired Mary Kay Worker Wins Job Suit Verdict over dismissal of ailing sales 'contractor' may be first of its kind Peter Page The National Law Journal December 12, 2002 Printer-friendly Email this Article Reprints & Permissions A jury in Texas hit cosmetics giant Mary Kay Inc. with an $11.2 million verdict, including $10 million in punitive damages, for firing a sales manager disabled by cancer, who, the company contended, was not an employee but an independent contractor. Plaintiff's counsel Angela Alioto said the judgment is the first of its type in the United States and is a significant first step toward extending some workplace legal rights to sales contractors. "This verdict means the 920,000 alleged independent contractors working for Mary Kay have their civil rights," asserted Alioto of the Law Offices of Joseph L. Alioto and Angela Alioto in San Francisco. "If they get sick, they have a remedy. They can take a leave." Woolf v. Mary Kay Cosmetics, No. 00-5612-J (Dallas Co., Texas, Dist. Ct.). The case was brought by Claudine Woolf, who began selling Mary Kay products in 1995. In January 1997 Woolf attained the rank of "Fabulous 50s director" for assembling a 50-person sales organization at the age of 27, according to court documents. Her company car was upgraded to a cherry-red Pontiac Grand Am, and, according to Alioto, she stopped selling directly and switched to managing her sales team full time. In March 1997, Woolf learned that she was pregnant. Two weeks later she was diagnosed with an aggressive form of breast cancer. Doctors told her that she required a mastectomy followed by chemotherapy that could kill the fetus or cause birth defects and would probably make her sterile. Woolf and her husband chose to continue the pregnancy. Although she gave birth two months prematurely, she and the baby are now healthy. Although Woolf was, according to her description, "sick and bald and pregnant," she continued running her sales operation from her hospital room, but could not meet sales quotas. According to plaintiff's documents, Woolf called Mary Kay headquarters in September 1997 asking for a reprieve from the sales goals. Mary Kay managers denied the request and a month later took away her company Pontiac Grand Am from in front of her parents' home. Woolf filed suit in Contra Costa County, Calif., in 1998, claiming that she had been wrongly fired because of a medical disability. Mary Kay prevailed in having the case moved to Dallas, where it is headquartered. After a two-week trial, the jury found that Woolf was a Mary Kay employee and the company "acted with oppression or malice" by refusing to accommodate her illness. Alioto argued that, despite an agreement Woolf signed with Mary Kay stipulating she was a contractor, and federal tax filings as an independent contractor in 1995 through 1997, she was an employee managing a sales organization under the direction of Mary Kay. Alioto expects Mary Kay to appeal. Defense counsel Ellen L. Perlioni of San Francisco-based Littler Mendelson's Dallas office declined to comment, other than to say the case is pending. " reminded me of the woman who commented on how she had her directorship taken away when her family was very ill. Thought this would be a boost to those in a similar predicument, to show that theres always a way that you can "stick it to the man!"

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-21 06:16:35 http://www.legalnewswatch.com/ 108/jury-awards-112m-in-mary-k ay-suit this is a site that tells of several peoples responses to the story of the woman i sent above....whats crazy is the amount of people who think that cancer isnt a big deal and that she should have done her job instead of file a lawsuit...seriously?...wow

Lazy Gardens   |2009-04-21 08:47:13 Unfortunately the verdict for Woolf was overturned on appeal. You are NOT an employee and none of the laws that protect them apply.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-22 10:35:51 i think that if you sell a different companies product and not your own then you are an employee in some way, and its the hope that it gives, that there is a chance when someone does you wrong to make it right

mkisfinewithme  - People Need To Be Responsible For Themselves!   |2009-04-23 13:26:36 I am a MK IBC. I have NOT experienced the horrors that I have read about MK, but then again I am not the type to ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN TO ME. I WAS NOT "coerced" into buying truckloads of product upfront, in fact I bought ZERO upfront, it was not necessary in order for me to sell. That is what the starter kit and full size products were for that I paid the $100 for. I order and pay for EXACTLY what I PERSONALLY WANT TO USE and what my customers HAVE PRE-PAID FOR, period. YES, my recruiter and Director thought it would be nifty if I STOCKED INVENTORY. Know what I did, I USED MY BACKBONE AND STOOD ON MY TWO BIG FEET AND SAID NO THANK YOU! It was relatively easy. I also USED THE BRAIN I WAS BORN WITH, if I want a new TOTE BAG OR PEN, I GO TO THE APPROPRIATE STORE AND BUY IT, I don't STOCK UP and pay FOUR TIMES WHAT IT COSTS BRAND NEW RETAIL, HELLO?? How many of you actually LISTENED AND PROCESSED what MK said to you to get you recruited and then in the tapes on the IN TOUCH website???? Remember the one where Mary Kay Ash herself said " Money is not the most important thing to people, PRAISE AND RECOGNITION IS..." Do you think MK USES THAT PRINCIPLE TO GET YOU TO BUY THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF STOCK????? STOP BLAMING EVERYONE ELSE FOR YOUR SCREWUPS AND LACK OF BACKBONE WITH MK AND TAKE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY, YOU ARE GROWNUPS, NOT CHILDREN!

PinkPhobia   |2009-04-23 13:31:44 Quote: Mary Kay Ash herself said " Money is not the most important thing to people, PRAISE AND RECOGNITION IS..." Do you think MK USES THAT PRINCIPLE TO GET YOU TO BUY THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS WORTH OF STOCK????? actually, yes, i think MK does use that principle to do just that. i haven't been on this site long, but i know the other regs have seen many comments just like yours. you obviously don't understand what many of the girls here have been through. it's rude to assume that your situation is unique simply because you have a backbone and, in your opinion, we don't. get off your high horse. for the record, tracy will probably give you the boot for your condescending attitude.

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-04-23 13:37:56 YOU SEEM VERY UPSET, MKISFINE! IF YOUR MARY KAY BUSINESS IS SO FINE, AND YOU HAVE SUCH A STRONG BACKBONE, WHY ARE YOU HERE YELLING AT US IN CAPITAL LETTERS! Why don't you spend your time in a non-negative way: get yourself out there and sell a Miracle Set! And don't forget to recruit, recruit, recruit! Be a grownup!

pinkpeace   |2009-04-23 14:18:51 Quote: STOP BLAMING EVERYONE ELSE FOR YOUR SCREWUPS AND LACK OF BACKBONE WITH MK AND TAKE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY, YOU ARE GROWNUPS, NOT CHILDREN! ZZZZZZ . . . wha? Did you hear that? I think there's a little gnat buzzing around PT.

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-23 14:48:56 Wow. Ms. MKISFINE is MAD! You think she's mad now? Wait 'til she finds out the truth.

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-04-23 14:49:00 Quote: ZZZZZZ . . . wha? Did you hear that? I think there's a little gnat buzzing around PT.  Where's the little pink fly swatter when ya need it?

PinkPhobia   |2009-04-23 15:03:51

raisinberry   |2009-04-23 17:20:47 Gee, MKISFINE isn't going to do too well either! Sell as you go is just as unprofitable as having a full store. And Look! She knows MK coerces women with praise and recognition to overbuy product and she STILL WANTS TO WORK FOR THEM ANYWAY!!!! Way to have a BACKBONE!!!!

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-23 17:37:44 wow to say that everything bad that happens to you is always your own fault?..sometimes yes i think that we can all agree...but there are things that others do to you and take advantage of you especially if you are very gullable or just trusting...and truly i dont think thats that big of a fault, we learn but to say people are screwups without knowing their personal problems with it. and wont allow it to happen to you? have you jumped them for trying? have you seen their reaction to know what will happen?

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-23 18:42:20 Hello Ms. MKISFINE, You come here to Pink Truth and tell me I'm wrong when I tell my opinions of my experiences. You may not agree with or understand my opinions, but that does not make them wrong. You may not like my opinions, but once again, that does not make them wrong. However, I understand where YOU are coming from. I remember when I was fogged and it was very easy to be filled with righteous indignation if anyone made fun of or criticized anything to do with Mary Kay. WHY? Because I was thoroughly brainwashed. Plus, I Wanted So Badly for it to be true. I wanted to provide for my family. I held on to this false belief(that this was possible) for many years. I wondered about but did not really find out about all the behind the scenes shenanigans until I started reading Pink Truth. I understand why you're angry and I understand why you believe it's all my own fault. I was where you are once. I hope you leave Mary Kay before you wake up many years down the road sick inside at all the time and money you wasted on a "business", that for 99 out of 100 consultants, does not work. By the way, how come your words are posted here at Pink Truth, but my words are NOT posted at Reflections?

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-23 18:53:19 Hi Ican'tbelieveit, Excellent Point. I Agree.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-23 19:47:54 thank you, things like that tick me off its like the story i posted you wouldnt believe what some of the consultants said about her...she did it to herself and that its all her fault and cancer is gods way of punishing her...total bs! i think it was gods way of showing her mary kay wasnt what she thought it could be!

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-04-23 20:16:59 Quote: ...cancer is gods way of punishing her. Anyone who would say that it sick, evil, and a psycho.

The Scribbler   |2009-04-24 00:31:15 "You wouldnt believe what some of the consultants said about her...that it's all her fault and cancer is God's way of punishing her.." Going by that pink logic, that would mean that God has been punishing NSD Rena Tarbet for years. Sheesh, don't these drones ever THINK? "How come your words are posted here at Pink Truth, but my words are NOT posted at Reflections?" Probably because of this:

PinkPhobia   |2009-04-24 06:36:39 lol scrib, is that 'shopped???

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-24 10:15:37 Scribbler you have some really funny pictures do you make them?

The Scribbler   |2009-04-24 11:01:04 Yep, that's a Scrib 'Shop, PinkPhobia, although it's not far from what some NSDs are garbling to the downline (as in, "One of the reasons you can be terminated as a consultant is for NEGATIVISM." ~NSD Rena Tarbet) ICBI, yes, I do all my own stunts.

PinkPhobia   |2009-04-24 11:11:16 omg, "negativism"??????? that's not even a real freakin WORD!!!!!!!!

unspokenthoughts  - Thank You   |2009-04-24 12:57:15 I have lurked a while like the lady that started this post I found this site by accident... I was actually trying to pull up my webpage, partially excited, because I at that point had just recieved my starter-kit..Mind you I was skeptical fom the get-go... One reason is because I lost my job a week or so before a pretty close associate started telling me about it, and how I should join..I figured this may be a better route... I have not put anymore money into it, but I had been wondering about sending starterkit back... Does anyone have any suggestions about sending the kit back??...

unspokenthoughts   |2009-04-24 12:59:37 or getting rid of the products????

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-24 14:13:27 uspokenthoughts, you are making a wise decision to get out now before you load up on debt. Welcome to Pink Truth!!

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-24 14:25:54 Hello Unspokenthoughts, You are way ahead of the game to get out early. You can start on the Home page. In the left hand column you'll find Quitting Mary Kay. Then post any questions you have on the Discussion Board. The women here will help you. Welcome to Pink Truth!

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-24 15:48:52 MKisfinewithme said: STOP BLAMING EVERYONE ELSE FOR YOUR SCREWUPS AND LACK OF BACKBONE WITH MK AND TAKE PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY, YOU ARE GROWNUPS, NOT CHILDREN! Wow, bitter much....Yet another cowardly MK lady coming onto PT and spewing a bunch of scripted lies they were fed by their SD, and then not sticky around to explain why they say such ridiculous things. One day you'll be back PT giving us your "I" story on why you left MK. I'm looking forward to talking with you when you have something new to say then the same old "lazy loser" argument.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-24 16:37:52 Scribbler thats awesome that you make those. unspoken isnt it crazy how by accident to be led here?...a great hint in its own i think!

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-24 17:32:42 I take RESPONSIBILITY for myself, my actions, my decisions, I do NOT try to blame them on others. I ACCEPT the consequences for those actions and decisions, WORKS WELL FOR ME. Brainwashed, hardly, I AM NOT the one that has THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS WORTH of inventory sitting on a shelf, now am I? Some of you seem to want PITY? WHY? You are GROWN WOMEN, ADULTS, that means YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE for what you do. Your FIRST mistake was BELIEVING and ACTING ON what all but PERFECT STRANGERS TOLD YOU TO DO WITH YOUR MONEY! You want to hand your personal power over to a corporation, strangers, that is your choice, BUT NOT MINE. What is the WORST thing that can happen to me, GET "FIRED" FROM MARY KAY? OK, I can buy my products off of the "bay" AT LEAST as cheap as I can get them wholesale directly from Mary Kay. I have no rude awakening coming, I never put on those ROSE COLORED SUNGLASSES in the first place!

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-24 20:51:16 .......(as in, "One of the reasons you can be terminated as a consultant is for NEGATIVISM." ~NSD Rena Tarbet) ...ugh, reminds me of hearing her speak. She always said thing like this. You should hear her CD set about how to be rich in MK like her.....

unspokenthoughts  - Just thoughts   |2009-04-25 04:10:16 Thank You all very much... I do think it was a good thing I found the sight and not a mistake.... MKisfinewithme If you don't buy the inventory and just get what you need seems to me you're not making much money.. With the amount of shipping and handling I thought maybe I could work the business the way you do, but how are you really winning??? Unless you have a large number of people below you that are making investing and trying to make it work.... You yourself don't make a big profit off of selling alone.... Or maybe I am wrong Like I said I am sill very new....

Lazy Gardens   |2009-04-25 08:16:25 "Your FIRST mistake was BELIEVING and ACTING ON what all but PERFECT STRANGERS TOLD YOU TO DO WITH YOUR MONEY!" Missy, I suggest you read about the Milgram and the Standford experiments. Anyone is vulnerable, part of the time, for letting perfect strangers tell them what to do. Mary Kay's most successful recruiters are perfectly dressed, perfectly groomed, and perfectly rehearsed in how to find out what your hot button is and push it to get you to sign up to join their perfect job and joi8nh them in their perfect life.

pinksedition   |2009-04-25 09:03:09 MKisfinewithme, you are spewing a bunch of ignorant anger. If none of this applies to you, then why are you here? Don't downplay the collective scope of our experience and chalk it all up to stupidity. There are alot of people here who appear to be much farther along than you and were more successful by MK standards. There are even some SD's on here who just walked away and they weren't hurting like others here. We aren't all hallucinating here yet you feel like you need to negate all that we experienced to make us look stupid and yourself superior. It's not working. You really just make yourself sound like a cold hearted, ignorant, callous bitch. If you want a legit discussion, open up the floor with reason and questions, not spewing your nasty insults. Be an adult and you will get treated as such here.

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 09:08:05 To: Unspokenthoughts; I guess it depends on what you want and what you determine to be successful for yourself? For me, I pay for my MK personal items, I make about $500 a month for about 12 hours of work. It suits me. Mary Kay WORKS FOR ME, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND. To Lazy Gardens; Here is a thought, DON'T BE A SUCKER for con artists? Yea they are perfectly dressed. Yea, they are well spoken, so what? You do understand the word NO, right? Ever read Mary Kay Ash's autobiography, "Mary Kay?" Within the first 3 chapters she tells about her company incentive. When she started it, most of her Reps were making $150 in sales, so she devised a GOLD PLATED GOBLET AWARD for ANYONE who made a $1000 a week goal in sales. GUESS WHAT? By the end of two years, she had given away so many of them, she quit inscribing them and Reps were asking her to buy them back, they had so many! What does that tell you about people? About that old adage that there is "A SUCKER BORN EVERY MINUTE?" You ladies need to put your BIG GIRL PANTIES ON, sit down, figure out EXACTLY WHERE YOU ARE FINANCIALLY and PRECISELY HOW you are going to make the best of it and GET OUT OF THE SITUATION YOU PUT YOURSELVES IN. Sitting around crying, moaning and groaning does NOTHING to address the situation, NOTHING. NO, I do not think I am superior or better, while Mary Kay did not get me in a bad situation, SOMETHING ELSE LONG AGO DID AND I LEARNED FROM IT! Let me share some of my HARD WON AND LEARNED INFO HERE; You ladies THOUGHT you could get all dolled up, look beautiful, smell terrific and have a GRAND OLE TIME playing makeup party and make a MILLION DOLLARS, now tell the truth. That recruiter/director TOLD YOU EXACTLY WHAT YOU WANTED TO HEAR, OWN IT, FESS UP AND MOVE ON! NO ONE did ANYTHING to you, BUT YOURSELF! Did you EVER stop to think, to ask yourself, "IF IT IS THIS EASY, WHY DOES THIS PERFECT STRANGER WANT TO MAKE ME RICH, WHILE I AM HAVING A BALL????? Common sense here, ladies!

vintagegold   |2009-04-25 09:39:06 MKisfinewithme - I was a a con artist when I was recruiting in MK. I memorized the objection overcomers, I used women's fears about income insecurity. I preyed on their desire to get rich. I used fear tactics like "What if your husband loses his job? It's always nice to have something on the side just in case..." and I used women's love of their children against them "Do it for your kids." After my first handful of recruits, I found pinktruth and grew a conscience. I read about long time Directors getting into serious financial debt and how their families were ruined because of it. I changed and I know other women change because of pinktruth. While I agree that there should be some level of personal responsibility for what has happened, a lot of the "training" you get in Mary Kay is unethical and immoral (husband unawareness plan). We aren't here to whine and groan about being conned. We are sharing our stories to spare many other women financial ruin and heartache.

The Scribbler   |2009-04-25 11:46:57 MKisfinewithme, my goodness, where's the compassion, love?  Why such disdain towards women you don't even know? (And shoot, some of us might indeed know you in real-life, so don't make it awkward next time we see you...come to think of it, weren't you buying maxi-pads the other day in Target?) As Lazy Gardens stated, Mary Kay recruiters are well-trained in hitting you where the soft spots are. The tricky aspect of this is that many times, you're not aware that such exploitation is going on.   I've never been in Mary Kay - my personal experience came via a MK director friend and fellow churchgoer who told me that "she wanted to get to know me better." That weekend, I'm thinking I'm going to enjoy some fellowship with this gal, until I walked in the coffeehouse door and saw her in full MK uniform, brochures at the ready. The feeling of being so blatantly deceived (and by a fellow Christian, no less) is one I'd prefer not to experience again. For my part, I'd like to share what MK leaders are teaching about this topic. Humor me for a sec, if you please: Listen to everything your director tells you. She has a vested interest in you. (NSD Shannon Andrews) Listen to your mentors. Learn their techniques. (NSD Lynda Jackson) I will ALWAYS tell you what is best for your business. I wouldn’t be doing my job if I didn’t!  (Director educational document) If you’re not willing to listen to your director, the director should move on. (slightly paraphrased from a quote via NSD Dacia Wiegandt) While I applaud you for not falling into the inventory trap, MKIFWM, you must understand that you are in the minority, and it's not because the majority of women who get yanked into MK are stupid.  It's because intricate, well-honed manipulation is being taught to MK recruiters from women who have been manipulating for decades: the NSDs. Only it's not called "manipulation." It's called something more kinder and even biblically-sounding, such as "sharing" and "meeting her needs."   If you want to direct your anger towards anything, MKIFWM, you should be directing it towards the leaders teaching the manipulation, not the women who were snared by it.

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-25 12:09:01 MKisfinewithme- It seems to me that you have some sort of curiosity about "what if MK is not what I've been told", or you wouldn't be here. If you really are here for answers then it would be better if you behaved more like an adult and asked actual questions so the women can help answer them and we can have a real debate. In order to do that, however, it requires you to stop the name calling and stop assuming you know everything about the women here on PT. With that said, if you are not here to get questions answered, then why are you here? The amount of time you are spending on PT is not considered "pink time" or "green time". I would be very careful about telling people in MK you are spending time here. If your SD finds out you have been here she will forever look at you differently. The reason?  It's because they (SDs and NSDs)all know that once you have read the countless stories of the very successful former SDs on here you will have lots of questions. They know that once you read the FACTS about MK you will start to look at the meetings, seminars, your "business plan" differently. Even if your SD "loves" you to death, she will always wonder about you. This kind of treatment, which I have seen time and time again, should be the biggest proof that MK has something to hide. If your beloved MK can't with stand a few questions then there is obviously something wrong.

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-25 12:13:21 Mkisfinewithme, By the way, the only reason the 1% of women in MK who actually make that "millions of dollars playing with makeup" is because they have lots and lots of women like you placing orders. They don't actually do anything. They just sit back and make speeches to get more women like you to place more and more orders. If there wasn't women making those ridiculously high orders they wouldn't be a NSD in the first place.

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-25 12:31:06 Vintage Gold wrote: We aren't here to whine and groan about being conned. We are sharing our stories to spare many other women financial ruin and heartache. Thank you Vintage Gold for saying it so clearly. Every few days someone comes here (of their own free will) and says thanks to PT they will not sign up or they will not order inventory. That's why we're here and I'm proud to be part of it. Thanks to PT I am no longer sending my money to the Ash family. They obviously have enough and certainly don't need anymore of mine. If I can be of any help to anyone else, well that's just the icing on the cake.

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-25 12:51:21 Hello Ms.MKISFINE, You wrote: NO, I do not think I am superior or better, while Mary Kay did not get me in a bad situation, SOMETHING ELSE LONG AGO DID AND I LEARNED FROM IT! Since you know what it's like to be lied to, cheated or scammed, why are you bound and determined to keep us from discussing our issues of being lied to, cheated and scammed? We learned from our experiences, too. We are hoping to help others from being cheated. We are also helping each other. We ARE facing it, dealing with it, and MOVING ON. Some of us are still healing. Some of us are healed and are here to support others. Maybe you're so angry because you didn't have a group like this to come to a long time ago. For my own situation, I accept 50% of the blame. 50% I did. 50% was done to me.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-25 13:42:37 mkisfinewithme good golly such hostility for someone so prideful of ones self. could be just a tad more nice to get people to see your side, and no one was hostile with you until you appeared out of no where and bam! LOL you make for a good laugh tho because alot of people who say they take the high road say they are great and get hostile to think they are defending themselves and also try to be so rude are usually the ones who need the pity, for they are usually the ones with the most problems that they dont want to admit that they have and being rude is a way of getting the attention that they want.

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-25 14:30:39 So......ummmm mkisfinewithme....are you still there? Well...what is your first question? Unless you have a valid question for us to answer, I am going to ignore your name calling rants. While you're deciding whether to do the right thing or not, you might want to stop by the left side of the home page and read some PT member stories. You could call them their "I" story of how and why they left MK. You might be surprised what you find.

pinkpunch   |2009-04-25 14:50:35 I have a feeling that this poor soul has very little self esteem and relys on MK to regain a false sense of worth. Too bad she doesn't even know it...yet. Instead of constantly hearing: Book Sell Recruit I think she needs to be constantly hearing Church Therapy Ange r Management

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 16:20:15 This is too funny! To whomever up there is just positive they saw me in Target buying Maxipads, LOL, not hardly, haven't needed such for YEARS! LOL LOL NO ONE in MK EVER lied to me about anything. Being able to LIE to me would entail that I BELIEVED THEM in the first place. I did not. IF IT SOUNDS TOO GOOD TO BE TRUE, IT IS. PEOPLE HAVE BEEN LEARNING THIS LESSON AGAIN AND AGAIN FOREVER! BTW, I have NEVER recruited anyone to MK, period. I never had the least intention of doing so from the start, why would I? I wanted CUSTOMERS to buy from me and pay FULL RETAIL on a repeated basis, I wanted 50% commission, NOT 4%, HELLO!!! I became a MK IBC to get that 50% discount ON MY OWN PERSONAL PRODUCTS! The $500 a month I clear on MK is GAMBLING MONEY at the Casinos that we go to on a monthly basis. BTW, to the COW that was calling me filthy names, PFFFTTT, someone is sitting on multiple THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS worth of inventory, obviously! LOL LOL LOL Too bad for you, sweetheart. Glad it's you and not me!

The Scribbler   |2009-04-25 17:52:40 "To whomever up there is just positive they saw me in Target buying Maxipads, LOL, not hardly, haven't needed such for YEARS! LOL LOL joke [johk] –noun 1. something said or done to provoke laughter or cause amusement, as a witticism, a short and amusing anecdote That being said, I envy the heck out of you, love, as menopause for me is still a couple of decades away.   Now I suppose you're going to tell me that you were just buying Kotex pads to use as refills for your Swiffer WetJet.

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 18:40:24 SCRIBBLER Would not trade places with you for a million dollars, seriously. I LOVE my life and the stage I am in right now. It has NEVER been better than this! To Whomever I keep reading about being "snared" etc, please stop announcing to the world that you are as stupid as a rock. That is NOTHING TO BE PROUD OF! To the woman who HAS NEVER been an MK IBC, you have no experience of your own to talk from, all of yours is second hand, pardon me if I don't take that seriously And I HAVE TO ADDRESS all this Christian crap that I keep reading about associated with Mary Kay. I am an atheist, I have ZERO DESIRE to be associated with Christian values of any kind, I see the PRACTICAL results of what you GOOD, HOLY CHRISTIANS pull on a daily basis, NO THANK YOU! I never bought into that with Mary Kay either and I am not buying into it with you people.

pinksedition   |2009-04-25 19:44:57 Mkisfinewithme, you are incredibly nasty, demeaning and insulting. You should be horrified by what you are writing. Do you have nothing better to do than sit around here and be insulting? What do you have to prove here? What purpose are you serving? Do you think that typing over and over that we are stupid and dumb as rocks is doing anything? Do you really think we are going to read your words and think to ourselves...Wow, she's so right! Damn, it never occurred to me that I was stupid and promulgating it over the internet. Hang on and let me pull my head out of my own ass and kiss your feet. While you may feel that what we share is not productive, it is to many others. Don't trample on that. If this site has nothing for you, then go.

puc4now   |2009-04-25 19:52:05 Hormone replacement therapy. Seriously. Look into it, mkisfinewithme. That would explain a lot about you. LOL LOL LOL to you.

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 20:11:28 PINKSEDITION Your problem like so many others on this site is you want to wallow in self pity and see how many people you can get to feel sorry for you. That is a total waste of time and energy, truly. It is NOT NASTY to TELL THE TRUTH. Whether you want to admit it or not, I have done NOTHING ELSE BUT. You just don't like ANYONE saying it to your face, that's all.

puc4now   |2009-04-25 20:14:34 Put down the drink and back away from the slots. The casino bus that goes to your trailer park is leaving now. Hurry!

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 20:23:13 Let me share with you folks HOW I became a Mary Kay IBC. I did a google search, went on the Mary Kay site, entered my zip code to find an online store and started from there. Got the names of a few MK IBCs and contacted them. The one I chose to be my recruiter, LIVES TWO COUNTIES OVER FROM ME, that is EXACTLY why I chose her. Spoke with her on the phone for 5 minutes, got the invite, did the online agreement registration and WHAM, within TWO days got my starter kit. YEA, she started with that "you have to have inventory" crap, SHE GOT TOLD UPFRONT, NOT JUST NO, BUT HELL NO. She then started with that "You have to if you want...." again, she was told UPFRONT, "I DON'T WANT TO BE SUCCESSFUL, I WANT MY ITEMS AT 50% OFF AND THAT IS THE ONLY REASON I SIGNED UP." Guess what, haven't heard from her since! Have never even spoken to, emailed or been in contact with my "Director." Don't plan to be either, neither do I plan to attend any meetings, seminars or anything else, no interest whatsoever. See, one does not have to get suckered to get the better end of the deal!

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 20:26:55 PUC4NOW You MUST be thinking about your Mama, not me. I assure you, you could not rent where I live and own for one night. What's the matter, foodstamp benefits run out already? Try some churches and see if they will give you something, act pitiful like you do here and they just might.

puc4now   |2009-04-25 20:29:14 Just pull up your Big Girl Depends and peddle your Mary Kay elsewhere. LOL LOL LOL

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 20:32:39 At least I have been successful at it, OBVIOUSLY you FAILED.

puc4now   |2009-04-25 20:45:27 Oh, yeah, you're pure class. LOL LOL LOL

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 20:55:45 PUC4NOW A great deal brighter than you and better able to handle my business. I am not on here complaining. Get all my items for free and make money while I am doing it.

pinksedition   |2009-04-25 21:40:39 FYI, I'm not wallowing in self pity. I was a successful consultant by MK standards and could sell circles around most people. I CHOSE not to do it because I think supporting a company with unethical practices is ridiculous. I'm not sure where you think I am wallowing in anything. Everything I've ever pursued has been more than successful. My life is awesome and have no complaints. I've had some incredible career experiences and a new one is taking off. Your response was nothing short of spiteful and vindictive. There has been no thread of truth to anything you've said to me specifically or anyone else here. You have no clue what you are talking about and your willful, malicious ignorance is becoming laughable. Please continue to entertain us with your vile behavior. We anxiously await your less than stellar response.

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 21:47:10 PINKSEDITION Read your posts, see your SN, it says it ALL. You invest way too much negative energy to be someone who is all that successful, kwim? You got "HAD" and you HATE someone telling you so to your face, too bad, too sad, deal. I have no doubt your "...taking off..." is the story of your life, always "gonna" do this or that, always at the beginning, etc, etc. I truly feel sorry for you losers, I honestly do and I am so glad NOT to be among your number.

The Scribbler   |2009-04-25 22:05:55 "To the woman who HAS NEVER been an MK IBC, you have no experience of your own to talk from, all of yours is  second hand, pardon me if I don't take that seriously..." You have the choice not to take me seriously, friend - that doesn't make the material and quotes I cite any less true. Any IBC experience I would have had would not matter one whit to you, as I see how poorly you're treating the women here who were directors and IBCs. As many others here have stated before me, if this site gets your dander up so much, why are you staying here? If you need a friend, just say so! If you need someone to talk to, say so - there are so many listening ears here for you! If it's respect you're looking for, well, you have to go-give it if you hope to receive it. MKisfinewithme, please cease with the disrespectful and uncalled-for postings or risk being banned by the site's owner. Thank you kindly.

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-25 22:11:46 PUC4NOW said: You MUST be thinking about your Mama, not me. ummmm.....a "your mama" joke?.....really?  What is this...3rd grade? I second what pinksedition asks:  Why are you here? You obviously don't have any questions and if you could care less about "bee"ing more in MK then why do you even care?   I think if you're mad about MK trying to be a Christian company then you should go to one of their sites and complain to them about it. PT has written time and time again that MK is not a Christian company, only pretending to be to manipulate people. Again, why are you even here? What are you trying to get out of being here?  ???????????????????????????? ????

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-25 22:15:14 my bad, I meant to say: MKisfinewithme said: You MUST be thinking about your Mama, not me. Sorry puc4now!

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-25 22:35:30 SCRIBBLER I WILL NOT join in the pity party nor will I give sympathy for situations that people CREATED FOR THEMSELVES. As to being banned, I COULD NOT CARE ANY LESS, honestly. IF this site is for the sole purpose for everyone who allowed themselves to get taken to slaughter like sheep to whine, cry, screech, rant and complain, I have NO INTEREST in participating, NONE. Life is HARD, COLD AND CRUEL. WOMEN especially NEED TO GET A GRIP AND QUICKLY ON THAT SET OF FACTS! LIFE AINT YOUR KITCHEN OR YOUR FAMILY, GET OVER IT!

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-25 23:57:46 Mkisfinewithme, O.k., now you are just plain annoying. If you do not care about what we are saying and if what we are talking about is bothering you so much, then LEAVE!!!!! why are you sticking around to fly off the handle over something you could care less about??? You seem really bitter and unhappy. From what you have said it seems as though you are a negative person and I feel sorry for you. I hope that you put whatever it is you are drinking down, and go find a community project to get involved in. If you spent the same amount of time and energy in helping someone instead of being here accusing us of things you know NOTHING about, you might become a more positive person. You might even start enjoying your life again. But seriously though...therapy

icanbecomesane   |2009-04-26 00:45:06 Good-bye Ms.MKISFINE.

The Scribbler   |2009-04-26 00:45:54 Well, folks, I've done my best with this one - one can only toss so many pearls before swine, you know? I never would have imagined that life is not about the God you serve, the home you keep, or your precious family; but rather about you, your lousy 50% discount, and how much dough you can pump into the slots. Sounds like a rich, selfless, fulfilling life to me.

ladycasino   |2009-04-26 01:32:46 MKis fine....I am glad you are enjoying your success with Mary Kay and I hope they continue to help you pull in your $500/mo gambling monies. You know as well as everyone on this site that Mary Kay is a big fraud! When you attend their recruiting sessions they conveniently leave out the most important aspects of becoming an IBC. In addition, the products are not all that great and their marketing plans leave a lot to be desired. I thought this would be a great opportunity to make some extra money, but I was sadly mistaken. I am sure this opportunity works for some, but it is a big disappoint for me. Enjoy yourself and let us know in a year how things are going.

puc4now   |2009-04-26 01:38:19 Tracy'll need a straitjacket to get this one off the site. What a hoot!! Just goes to show you what happens when you spend all your MK profits on casinos instead of your meds!!! LOL LOL and LOL some more.

pinksedition   |2009-04-26 09:05:46 mkisfinewithme, you live a wasted and worthless life. You waste your words in spiteful and judgmental comments to others, you waste your time working and blowing money in worthless places, and waste your spirit bashing family and others spirituality. I'm glad you aren't my mother. A child would probably want to commit suicide seeing where you place family on your priority list.

mkisfinewithme   |2009-04-26 09:24:54 I am NOT devoting my time to resentment of a CORPORATION for imagined wrongs they have done to me. IF I was truly that unhappy, I would get out and forget they even existed instead of some vain attempt to gain some kind of retribution. I have NO idea what any of you are talking about as regards recruiting sessions, marketing sessions or anything else of the like. I have never even met a Mary Kay IBC or anyone else connected with Mary Kay in person. I have never and will never attend any such sessions, seminars, etc, I don't invest my time that way. I purchased my first Mary Kay products off of ebay, LOVED THEM and later decided to contact Mary Kay and sign up to be an IBC. I was NOT RECRUITED, I sought Mary Kay out on my own. I do not maintain any kind of contact with my so called recruiter, director or anyone else in Mary Kay. I place orders online, pay for them, receive them, deliver them and that is that. I really think you folks have invested way, way, way too much of yourselves, both financially and personally in Mary Kay and it has jaded you.

vintagegold   |2009-04-26 10:21:59 Again - We are not trying to gain retribution from a corporation for "imagined" wrongs they have done. We are trying to help other women learn lessons that they would have otherwise learned the hard way. It seems like you want other women to get screwed and learn the lessons the hard way just like you have. What is wrong with us warning them of what to expect? The reason you think Mary Kay is fine is because you have no contact with other IBC's and don't go to the "training sessions". New consultants who really want to make this work for them will trust their Director who appears successful. They will be told that the only way to be successful is to have a "full store" of inventory. If you aren't attending the meetings and talking to your recruit or Director, then you really have no idea what goes on in Mary Kay and you shouldn't judge us like that. Mary Kay has been around for 45 years because, like you said, "If it sounds too good to be true, it is. People have been learning this lesson again and again forever!". Well, we are trying to warn people in advance of what to expect. We don't just sit back and mock them waiting for them to find out the hard way.

pinksedition   |2009-04-26 10:25:59 Jaded? How do you figure? You are the one who said life isn't about family and that it is cold, hard, and cruel. Sounds pretty jaded to me. Are you just trying to stir the pot or are you seriously trying to convince us that we really all are stupid and losers? Do you really think we are just going to acquiesce to what you say and close up shop here? What's your deal? If you want to have a reasonable discussion, be reasonable. If not, take your rants elsewhere. We love to share with people about all sorts of things, not just MK. However, we definitely will share about that too. Unless, you think we are just too stupid and losers who have nothing of value to share with anyone. If that's the case, then go away because anything you are saying has absolutely no value here.

TRACY   |2009-04-26 10:48:18 MKisfinewithme - We're glad you found Pink Truth while searching for answers to those nagging questions you had about Mary Kay. We see that we've definitely struck a chord with you, and recognize your level of anger and frustration. Many of our members were in disbelief and denial as well when they first found Pink Truth. We encourage you to continue reading all the helpful viewpoints and cold, hard facts that are available here. When you're ready to participate in a positive fashion, please let me know and I'll restore your ability to post comments.

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-26 14:42:50 Thank you Tracy. This lady obviously doesn't have anything better to do then to rant and rave about a company she "could care less about".

pinkpeace   |2009-04-26 18:10:25 Holy smokes - I go away for one day, and look what happens! I'm blowing the bull$*** whistle here: She says she clears $500 a month. With a 60/40 split, that means she has to sell over $1200 a month. Yet the only reason she signed up was to get her products at 50% off. Ladies, when was the last time a personal use consultant consistently sold $1200 a month? *chirping crickets*

ILikeRedBetter   |2009-04-26 21:29:50 Pinkpeace - I was wondering the same thing myself. Could she have been actually a SD just pretending to be a personal use IBC? She sure sounded like she was just like every other SD that comes on here and gives us the "lazy loser" and "stop blaming and move on" argument.

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-04-27 01:29:42 "No? Next!"

Lazy Gardens   |2009-04-28 09:50:04 MaryKayIsFineWithMe - Do not assume that because someone was vulnerable to manipulation that they are, in your words, "Dumb as a rock". You, with your pride in being smart and independent, would be surprisingly easy to manipulate by someone who spotted those points of pride and tailored their spiel to them. Please read these two Wikipedia articles, and the website: The Milgram Experiment: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik... The Stanford Prison Experiment: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik... The Lucifer Effect: http://www.lucifereffect.org/ by the man who ran the Stanford Prison Experiment.

Lazy Gardens   |2009-04-27 10:56:24 TRACY: REQUEST Please turn JUSTIFICATION off for the blog. It's making weird spacing in the posts and making things hard to read. I thought it was my browser, but looking at the post I just made, it's the blog software.

icantbelieveit   |2009-04-27 21:02:36 wow seriously mkisfine you can say your beliefs but why be so demeaning? to waht others believe for being past pmsing you sure seem to have alot of it and not alot of experience being nice to people if you are so successful at mary kay and from reading if you really did so you would see that some on this site are still selling mary kay they have jsut learned alot from this site...really doesnt seem to be a bashing site...and for your age you would think that you could be more helpful in a nice way then so disrespectful and attacking peoples personal beliefs? that is soo wrong! dont critize people for that, and no one would have been hostile towards you if you had said your peace in a nice way, some have been able to do that, you cannot seem to do so, sorry that you seem to have such hateful opinions to those that are not that same as yours. have a great weekend period free unlike some of us, and the permanent pms you seem to still have lingering

ciavyn   |2009-04-28 06:18:35 Lazy - I actually took part in a re-enactment of the Milgram experiment that my psych professor thought would be an eye-opener for her students. She set us up with a former US Marshall who, without are being aware of anything going on, came into our classroom and began dictating orders. People jumped to do his bidding. One woman hyperventilated. Others just knuckled under. I'm happy to say I was the one who bucked him, and finally got him to reveal the ruse. However, you are absolutely right, and that is exactly what happens in Mary Kay.

TRACY   |2009-04-28 09:48:11 Lazy - It's actually not a justification problem. It's a problem with the comments... when someone posts a long link without using the link button above the box where you type your comment, the links actually break the whole comments section.

jilthepil12073  - MS MKISFINE   |2009-04-29 20:03:58 Let me ask you this. HOW MUCH MONEY ARE YOU PROFITTING FROM YOUR MK BUSINESS ????? I GOT MY STARTER KIT LAST NIGHT AND HAD ORIENTATION WITH MY DIRECTOR. I HAD NO IDEA THAT I WOULD BE PRESSURED TO FORK OVER AT LEAST $600 FOR INVENTORY. I WAS LAID OFF FROM WORKING FOR AN ATTORNEY BACK IN FEBRUARY. I AM DRAWING UNEMPLOYMENT NOW. THIS DIRECTOR PRESSURED ME FOR A CREDIT CARD OR TO GO TO FRIENDS OR MY BOYFRIEND. I TOLD HER THERE WAS NO WAY I COULD THAT ! I FIGURED SHE WOULD BE RINGING MY PHONE ALL DAY TODAY.....I THINK SHE FIGURED IT OUT THAT I AM A TOUGH COOKIE. NEEDLESS TO SAY....I HAVEN'T HEARD A WORD FROM HER TODAY.....GO FIGURE ! MK IS NOT FINE BY MY BOOK !

vintagegold   |2009-04-29 20:47:28 You ARE NOT required to get inventory. You should not be expected to stock inventory when you have no idea what your customers will need. From my own personal experience, MOST of the women I facialed just wanted an eyeshadow or mascara or lip gloss. They only bought from me because they felt pressured. Many women's lives revolve around Mary Kay, but from the outside, many of the women you will facial will be thinking about how they saw the same colors at the dollar store. Women want a bargain. Mary Kay is NOT recession-proof. They are struggling with high consultant turnover right now and it's not the consultant's fault. Women are hanging on to their money tighter than ever before. They might want a lipstick to make themselves "feel good", but they don't want $189.00 worth of skin care.

stillcurious   |2009-06-18 08:37:31 First I'd like to say I am glad to see mkisfinewithme hasn't been blocked. It does mean this is absolutely a place for free and open talk. However, this whole site seems to be filled with negative, biased and demeaning. MKIFWM is just standing up for how she feels, which is what everyone here is doing. Quit harassing each other. Some people do fine with MK, some do not. So. I do not have money to buy a starter kit and then inventory anyway. I am still thinking about selling however because I do love the product. But I guess I will get grilled for saying that. So be it.

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-06-18 08:52:20 Read the Welcome page, Stillcurious. Thanks for the laugh.

pinkpunch   |2009-06-18 09:24:48 Quote: First I'd like to say I am glad to see mkisfinewithme hasn't been blocked. It does mean this is absolutely a place for free and open talk. However, this whole site seems to be filled with negative, biased and demeaning. MKIFWM is just standing up for how she feels, which is what everyone here is doing. Quit harassing each other. Some people do fine with MK, some do not. So. I do not have money to buy a starter kit and then inventory anyway. I am still thinking about selling however because I do love the product. But I guess I will get grilled for saying that. So be it. First, I'd like to acknowledge the fact that you have no clue to what it is you're even talking about. That's fair to say. You have no experiences what so ever. It's like me walking into a surgical room and expressing "My opinion" about the surgery to the surgeon. Um, wrong place to be expressing my useless opinion to an experienced person, when in fact I have none!   Second, what you also do not get is the brainwashing that goes on in the "Cult". It's kind of like you saying, "Hey, this Jonestown girl should have the right to encourage others to drink the kool aide." So, by all means, join the cult. But when you come back with a new screen name...oh like... Nowfurious just let us know how it went for you!

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-06-18 09:38:18 Very well put, Pinkpunch. Sometimes it is just baffling how foggy people are.

stillcurious   |2009-06-18 09:44:33 Don't worry all, this will be my last entry because the last responses simply proved my point. Thank you!

The Scribbler   |2009-06-18 09:46:19 StillCurious, welcome to you! If you want feel-good pink fluff, you'll get plenty of it from those director/NSD websites because they're out to accomplish two things: 1. Get you to sign an agreement 2. Get you to place a chunky inevntory order Here at PT, there is no ulterior recruitment motive, nor does anyone glean a commission from someone hitting 500 posts. We're here to serve a little "meat" to women who've been packed full of Mary Kay's brand of cotton candy. Sure, cotton candy's a lot of fun, tastes good, and give you a bangin' sugar rush, but if you try to live on it, you're going to be weak and sickly in no time. And while meat doesn't taste as good as cotton candy (or is nowhere near as fun...stupid negative meatloaf), it will properly nourish and strengthen you in the long run. You need both sides of the equation if you're going to make an educated choice for yourself, StillCurious. Please let me know if there's any way I can assist you as you browse through the site.

pinkpunch   |2009-06-18 10:13:53 Quote: Don't worry all, this will be my last entry because the last responses simply proved my point. Thank you! So very typical! She comes on here saying... Quote: However, this whole site seems to be filled with negative, biased and demeaning. MKIFWM is just standing up for how she feels,  So she launches hot coals and then when someone throws water ballons she cries and runs saying I told you so.   There are a ton of people that come on here with questions and concerns and guess what...we help them and also direct them in the right direction to help anwser those questions. Just like Scribbler did! Now do you walk into AAA meeting and say... "Hey, whats your problem. I know people who drink and they are just fine with it." Or do you walk into Weight Watchers and say "Ya know, food is not the enemy" So what's the difference with your comment? You have entered a site where people have gotten screwed by the company and their Sales Directors. Think before you post. Is that so hard?

pinkpunch   |2009-06-18 10:42:19 I know, I know...2 typos. I meant balloons and also AA meetings. But I would love to see anyone interested in doing the following... 1. Walk into AA meeting and say... "Hey, whats your problem. I know people who drink and they are just fine with it." Or 2. Walk into Weight Watchers and say "Ya know, food is not the enemy" Please do, report back with the reaction that you received, okay? (Bring your sunglasses to cover up a possible black eye/eyes) Just looking out for you.

icanbecomesane   |2009-06-18 12:35:02 Hello stillcurious, Can you finish this sentence? However, this whole site seems to be filled with negative, biased and demeaning. ...this whole site seems to be filled with negative, biased and demeaning - what? The end of the sentence is missing. I am curious what you are trying to say there. Also, I am glad you found PT. 6 months to a year from now you may need to find your way back.

chopportunity   |2009-06-18 13:31:03 Just a tip for you new people lurking and thinking of ways to engage us in contructive conversation, try not to insult is in your first post. It is rude and offensive. If you are looking for the positive spin on MK, try Mary Kay Intouch or the new blog by Rhonda Shasteen or the countless Unitnet sites out there. If you are looking for reality, real numbers, information, facts, truth, you've come to the right place. As Scrib so adequately pointed out, we get nothing for sharing our experiences and knowledge with you all. But now, the SD, IBC or NSD talking with you about the MK opportunity, well her check depends on you signing up and ordereing product. Question, who would you rather get information from, someone who will not benefit from sharing or someone who will get compensated if you make a certain decision? Forgive us if we get a little testy when called negative, biased or demeaning or are accused of harrassing people. We have all had difficult experiences in MK, are sharing these to help others make informed decisions and get a little tired of the gutless drive-by insulters. Have a great day and know, you were warned!

pinkboundries  - Here is an idea   |2009-07-07 13:58:26 I noticed Chopportunity (thank you for the Welcome!) mentioned the codependecy issue to someone new, and as I am recently a new consultant (almost done!) Why don't we all share not just our experience, strength, and hope, (as mentioned in 12 step meetingings) but also the Psychology in not just the selling "brainwashing?", but the potential clients "victims?". As far as my experience um Codependents being vulerable to a "friend" not stranger YOU BET! Wanting to "bee-lieve" my friend is sincere and hard time saying no to "a dream" Boundry issue. My boundry issue and her manipulation. May I recommend the book- BOUNDARIES. To take control of your life.

MandeeBee   |2009-08-08 02:43:44 Well, I did try and read all the comments here, but "mkisfinewithme"s comments just got so redundant I had to scroll to the bottom of the page instead. Here's my story. I'm currently a Mary Kay Indenpendent Beauty Constultant. Currently, I'm only staying on to sell to some family members and friends who use MK already, but lost touch with their consultants. Plus I can get products at wholesale if I want. However, a couple weeks ago, I was like "MKISFINEWITHME". M y friend recruited me and I thought, "Well, why not? I can make extra cash, get practice in owning a buisness, managing my finances, and if I want to, I can get a FREE CAR!" A few days after I had trained (over the phone; my friend and her director live out of state), I decided to put a big chunk of money into attending this year's Seminar. I told my director and recruiter and her mom I wasn't buying inventory because I didn't want to, and I didn't have the money to. They didn't push me to buy it, either. At first. When I went to Seminar, and voiced disagreements with how MK does some things, I was shut down. When I repeated again that I wasn't going to buy an inventory because I would have to take out a loan, and I don't want to do that at 18 (at least, unless it was for college or something important to my future), I was told that I should if I'm "serious about my MK buisness." After going to Seminar and realizing how MK REALLY runs things, I'm not going to run my buisness the MK way- ordering inventory and going to meetings because it will be the "key to my success". So, "mkisfinewithme", if you keep going in MK without pressures the rest of us experienced, good for you, and I wish you the best. But seriously, don't accuse other people of not having backbone, because I certainly do, and even though I vehemently expressed that I wouldn't purchase inventory, it didn't take too long before I was pressured by 3 people, one of whom I considered my best friend, to buy into the various things MK wanted me to do. I've realized that in order to be really successful in MK, you have to be in the pink fog, as I've seen it phrased on this site. Sure, the company has great products and does some good things (donating to charities, etc) but the culture is pretty pathetic. That's my 2 cents for the day P.S., I again repeat that none of us should be harrassing other people like this; it's silly. Also. Harrassing people over the internet is really imature.

MandeeBee   |2009-08-08 02:55:41 By the way (last thing, I promise!)... pinkpunch- You are absolutly correct. People who are discussing these things here had horrible experiences, and we are trying to support eachother. Personally, I view it as the same thing as harrassing protesters at a pro-choice rally if you're pro-life (or vice-versa). Notice I'm not taking sides here because this isn't a political debate site. Actually, it's not a debate site period. So I don't think that people should be coming on this site and criticizing people for differences in experiences with a company. It's juvenille, and most definitely not the point of PT. You can still share opinions without "yelling at people online" (all caps) and flat-out being rude. Oops, guess I had 4 cents today.

Anna   |2009-10-07 15:22:05 I pay compliments participants of a site. I ask to excuse me for my English, it not so good (I write to you from Russia). Some words wished to tell. I co-operate with company Mary Kay 4 years and as the consulter and 3 as Sales Director. Practically nobody purchases From us at once a lot of production, but it does not prevent to work and receive to us good commissions. Certainly, there are people who are disappointed in work of the adviser and leave, but the majority of them remain good clients because love production. And that I have read on this site - not company Mary Kay problem. It is a human problem. 1. Probably to you has got recruter which very rigidly pressed on you. It is not good, Mary Kay Ash did not learn the consulters to the such. Simply these people have not enough mind. 2. Probably, you should think before purchasing production. Whether and you is work? Whether you can sell so much? If to think at first - then there will be no disappointments. I wish all of you of good luck and love in a fit of temper.

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-10-07 16:42:56 Quote: ...not company Mary Kay problem. It is a human problem. Unfortunately, that is not true. If that were the case, there would be fewer cases of manipulation and abuse. And Mary Kay Ash DID teach her consultants to use her friends. Sorry to burst the bubble, but she was a money grabber, pure and simple. She knew that recognition and prizes would get her what she wanted: more product orders.  It is not a wonder that her son has taken it to unforeseen heights of greed. It has always been about money, under the guise of helping women.

Anna   |2009-10-07 22:32:51 Quote: She knew that recognition and prizes would get her what she wanted: more product orders.  We are talking about different things. Of course, the main component of the money business. It would be foolish to think that a corporation exists to give you gifts. But! you order a product to sell. In order to get their profits. If your business does not make you money, it is not a business. This is a soap bubble. You can not sell. You do not want to sell. You do not want to improve their lives. Whose fault is it? If gifts can make you commit foolish acts - this is greed. Quote: If that were the case, there would be fewer cases of manipulation and abuse. You talk about the company or consultants and directors?

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-10-08 07:17:23 Quote: We are talking about different things. Nope. If it were profitable, there would be no need for cheap trinkets and constant contests. In a real sales position, you are rewarded with real gifts for real sales to real customers. Since no retail is ever tracked and recorded in Mary Kay, a consultant is being rewarded for buying the products, not selling them. They don't give a flip if anything is ever sold. You savvy? Quote: You talk about the company or consultants and directors? I talk about the NSDs, the SDs, and the company that condones the widespread practice of misleading the masses. If it is just a "few bad apples", then how do you account for the same stories, the same scripts that contain the same lines of BS and lies of omission, in all of our National Areas? Read on...

Anna   |2009-10-08 09:04:28 Quote: They don't give a flip if anything is ever sold. You savvy? Of course, the company provides gifts for orders, and not for sale. Consultants do not sit in the company their sales reports. Pooschrat sales - the task of Directors. We do contests for its sales consultants. I like the director does not need a team that does not sell. All collapse in the end. And my consulters will be unhappy with me as director.   Why do not you sell a product? Your customers do not like it? I read on and on .... And I am sad that all so

Rachel   |2009-10-08 09:49:17 Quote: You can not sell. You do not want to sell. You do not want to improve their lives. Whose fault is it? All of us that ordered inventory wanted to sell it. We tried to sell. We thought we could sell it. Our leadership told us we could sell it. We worked hard trying to sell it. My story is typical. My sales director, who was the expert (or so I thought, and so Mary Kay tells us), recommended inventory, based on the amount of effort I wanted to put in. She calculated these recommendations based on information she got from her leadership. But I did not want to order right away. I needed to give it a test first, to see if I could really sell the stuff. So I talked to everyone I knew about it. People were (or seemed to be) interested and positive. Some of them indicated they would like to buy some stuff from me. A couple indicated they would be willing to hold skin care classes for me. So I went ordered what the "experts" said I should. My sales director had every confidence I could sell it. My friends said I was good at this. So I was also confident I could sell it. After all, I had done well at everything I worked at in the last 10 years. Why shouldn't I do well at Mary Kay? I worked very hard, organized my inventory, kept my paperwork carefully, held some parties, talked to everyone I knew about Mary Kay, and initially had some sales that seemed very good. My sales director told me how great I was doing.  Often, despite the large inventory I already bought, I did not have the product I needed. Sometimes, I ordered more than I really needed because Mary Kay offered a better deal if you ordered more. And I was confident I could sell it. My sales director was confident I could sell it. I was doing well. Plus, some of what I bought were things my sales director said I should have, just so I could demonstrate these products. She said I would sell more of them if the customers could try them out. Well, she was the expert. She should know. So I followed her advice. Over time, I put in more and more effort, and sometimes spent more money, on my sales director's advice, to package things really nicely so they would sell better, and to send catalogs out to people, so they would buy more. But I didn't sell more as I worked harder, and spent more on marketing the items. I actually sold less of the products. I didn't want to see it when I first started, but it turns out that my friends had bought from me (sometimes, at least), because they liked me, not because they wanted the stuff. And they weren't going to keep buying that much stuff every month. And getting new customers was very much harder than the experts had led me to believe. Because the fact is, there were too many people living too close to me that were already selling Mary Kay. Yes, that is because the things my sales director told me weren't true. Is it because that sales director was lying to me? Well, not exactly. She thought what she was telling me was true, because it was what she was trained to say, by her leadership, and by Mary Kay corporation. I worked very hard, tried very hard to sell, everyone thought I was good at selling, I followed all the advice of my sales director, exactly as she was trained by her leadership to give advice, and I lost money. And that is the story of most of the people who come here as consultants. Those who continued to follow advice and become sales directors themselves, they had it harder that me.

Rachel   |2009-10-08 09:54:09 So there are 2 reasons we lose money. 1) We listen to the people who are supposed to help us when they tell us to order too much. And they tell us that because Mary Kay the company, and the NSDs, train them to do that. 2) There are far more consultants in every area of the U.S. to serve the number of actual customers, so it is very hard to make sales. This is true because the system is set up to encourage recruiting more consultants with no limits. Mary Kay, the corporation, publishes training that encourages people to recruit as many consultants as they can, with no consideration at all as to whether more consultants are needed. Every single person in leadership trains that more recruiting is always better, and that there's no such things as market saturation with Mary Kay. And that is just a lie.

Rachel   |2009-10-08 10:05:39 Quote: I like the director does not need a team that does not sell. All collapse in the end. And my consulters will be unhappy with me as director.   Yes, that is exactly the problem. A director does what she is trained to do, and they are trained that it is normal that most of their consultants won't do much, and will be unhappy. They are trained to just keep getting more recruits to replace those who leave, and to work very hard at getting those new recruits to buy inventory. Most of the team does not sell, because there are too many consultants, and even though the sales directors get consultants to sign up by telling them it's easy to sell Mary Kay, in reality it is very hard to sell. Most of the consultants become unhappy, and quit. Very often, they are angry with their directors. Very often they just blame themselves. And yes, for nearly everyone, it does all collapse in the end. That is exactly what we are telling you. People keep buying inventory, and that keeps Mary Kay, the company, in profits. Meanwhile almost all of the people who are supposed to sell it make very little, or even lose money. Some of them send the product back for refund, and some of it is actually sold. Some of it is past the 12 months by the time the consultant or director finally realizes it is not working. Some of them just can't stand to send it back because they can't quite believe it really won't work for them, so they just hold on to it too long, and throw it away. Or sell it on eBay (you can check how many people sell Mary Kay very cheaply on eBay.) Also, some of the sales directors order things they do not need because they will lose their sales director status if they do not have enough orders, so they use their own money to make it up. They think they will gain more than they spend if they just keep their status as sales director (or get a bonus for a certain level of orders.) But in the end, they mostly lose. Of course, it does not get this bad until the market becomes saturated. I don't know how long it takes for that to happen in a new market, but the system guarentees that eventually (maybe after 5 years? Maybe 10?) the market WILL become saturated, because the system encourages too much recruiting.

Anna   |2009-10-08 12:37:49 Quote: (maybe after 5 years? Maybe 10?) the market WILL become saturated, because the system encourages too much recruiting. Hello, Rachel   Perhaps we, in Russia as something different. Mary Kay in Russia for 16 years. Consultants - more than 300.000 But very often I meet clients who say: "Oh, you're a consultant?" How cool, I lost my advisor and nowhere can buy cosmetics. We have very few consultants conducting classes, working with clients. I think somewhere 15.000 Others simply buy starter kit (not expensive), and then make orders for themselves - to receive the discount. Do you not?

Anna   |2009-10-08 12:40:20 And please tell me: what is the "inventory"? This is a big order? When the consultant generates a warehouse?

Lazy Gardens   |2009-10-08 18:10:26 Anna - The directors in the USA lie to the women they recruit. They do not tell them how many IBCs are in their neighborhood. In one small town I know of, with 8,000 people, there are at least 10 IBCs. That is too many, but they keep recruiting because recruiting brings bonuses and big orders. They encourage big inventories in order to get larger commissions.  Directors encourage IBCs to recruit their customers, and a director will recruit an IBC's customer if the IBC does not. Quote: Why do not you sell a product? Your customers do not like it? It is too expensive. We have many inexpensive cosmetics in the USA that are better. Yes, it will all fall down. We hope it will all fall down. The business model has some fatal flaws that can't be fixed.

Anna   |2009-10-09 01:05:45 Quote: It is too expensive. Too expensive for the United States, strange ... In my group there is a woman, she became a consultant after retirement. Her pension - 10,000 rubles or 333 dollars a month. She did not recruit, but only sells. It is the client - other pensioners. And she receives income in 2000 dollars per month. Why Russian pensioner can buy a MK, but for the American working women - it is too expensive.

dupedbypinkfriend   |2009-10-09 06:10:22 Anna, we are not here to argue with you. If it works for you, for now, that is fine. Mary Kay Cosmetics has been doing their shameful business here in the US for nearly 50 years. The market here is saturated with other inexpesive, good skin care and cosmetic products that we can go and buy without being hounded to sign up. There are too many MK consultants in every town and city all across the nation, because MKC does not protect their sales force. Women do not have much spare time to waste on having parties to earn a little bit of free product. The home party plan used to work, but is now outdated. The women here can only tell their stories to warn others what will likely happen if they waste their working lives on a career that is unlikely to bring them a decent income, benefits, and financial security. In time, the same thing is possible in other countries, depending on the market there. If you are looking to work hard at Mary Kay Cosmetics as a way to give you a good life, I suggest you come up with a Plan B. You have been warned. Protect yourself.

Lazy Gardens   |2009-10-09 06:50:54 Anna - The products' prices are 3 or more times higher than cosmetics of similar quality that I can purchase immediately by walking into any supermarket such as Wal-Mart, or any drugstore such as Walgreens. Why would a woman wait for an order for a $13 lipstick when she can get a better $4.50 lipstick from a major cosmetics manufacturer at the same time as she buys groceries or aspirin? The Mary Kay financial compensation in Russia may be different enough that recruiting is not encouraged. In the USA, unless you recruit, you can't get bonuses, cars, or any recognition. A woman who really ordered $4,000 every month and sold it all to her customers gets no car, no bonuses. A woman who recruits a few people and gets them to order a total of $4,000 a month from Mary Kay whether they sell any of it or not gets to call herself a "Director" and gets a car.

company sucks   |2009-10-30 06:15:13 mkisfinewithme: What I would like to know if that $500 a month after your expenses, like your shipping costs and party costs or do you just do reorders? What exactly do you make an hour? Do you know how to figure that? I assume you wait until you have a big order to place ($200 min) before you order. You must have quite a few customers to make $500 a month. You would need to place a $250 order every week. Is this how you do it? Just curious.

helpmeplease  - help   |2009-11-01 18:35:54 Can you help me with MK issues, I just signed up and I feel cheated and they asked me to lie to my husband and now I dont know what to do...how to get out and I havent even got my first inventory order. I was pressured and the lady goes to church were I do so I feel even more down???1399 in inventory with free products

vintagegold   |2009-11-01 19:23:11 helpmeplease - If you go to church with the same people that asked you to lie to your husband, you seriously need to realize that they aren't Christians and you should not worry about offending them by telling them you have no interest in selling Mary Kay. You can return any unopened products for a %90 refund. They refund tax too.

Kyori  - Please help me with the compensation plan?   |2009-11-04 19:13:04 How does the Mary Kay compensation plan work and do i need to invest anything to start working? THanks

vintagegold   |2009-11-04 19:53:55 Kyori - You must first buy products from the company and then try and sell them to people. Most people think Mary Kay is expensive compared to all of the $1.00 cosmetics on the market so you need to take that into consideration. Most women would rather pay $1.00 for a lip balm than Mary Kay's $13.00.

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