Mary Kay: Still Not the Answer to the Economy

MK certainly isn't the answer to the economy but maybe this recent email I received is:

Proposed plan to help the economy...

Sounds like a plan to me.
This is from an article in the St. Petersburg Times Newspaper on Sunday.

The Business Section asked readers for ideas on "How Would You Fix the Economy?"

I think this guy nailed it!

Dear Mr. President:

Please find below my suggestion for fixing Americas economy.

Instead of giving billions of dollars to companies that will squander the money on lavish parties and unearned bonuses, use the following plan.

You can call it the Patriotic Retirement Plan:

There are about 40 million people over 50 in the work force.

Pay them $1 million apiece severance for early retirement with the following stipulations:
1) They MUST retire. Forty million job openings - Unemployment fixed.

2) They MUST buy a new American CAR. Forty million cars ordered - Auto Industry fixed.

3) They MUST either buy a house or pay off their mortgage - Housing Crisis fixed.

It can't get any easier than that!

If more money is needed, have all members of Congress and their constituents pay their taxes...
If you think this would work, please forward to everyone you know.

It sure beats MK!

So what do you make of this paragraph from the Dallas Morning News article?

[quote]Median annual earnings for a direct sales worker is about $2,400, and 10 percent of direct sellers work at least 30 hours a week, Robinson said. Direct sellers typically earn between 25 and 50 percent of a sale. For most, it is a job where they can earn some money on the side. To earn lots more, sellers typically need to recruit new workers in addition to selling the product. [/quote]

Too bad they didn't follow this up with some real investigative reporting with Mary Kay. Earnings of $2400 per year? Yep, sounds about right - IF you're one of the successful ones.

And they're right about needing to recruit to make big dollars. Too bad it's such a minuscule number of sales directors who can even make $30,000 per year. Before expenses.

Sigh. When will there be a real reporter who can ask the tough questions - or at least glance through an Applause Magazine scoreboard?

At Mary Kay, some are happy earning $50 a week, while top directors can earn $1 million a year,Shasteen said.

Well.

The operative word in Rhonda Shasteen's sentence is "can". (And frankly, I have my doubts about the feasibility of making a million dollars in MK, but that's another box of rocks.)

MK continues to feed off of lovely sounding quasi promises that you "can have a pink cadillac", or that you "can be in control of how much you earn", blah, blah, blah. These teeny weeny truths are always embedded in such whopper lies.

[quote]Now I don't know if Rhonda was quoted wrong, or if she really made up such a whopper, but there is no sales director who has earned $1 million in a year from Mary Kay.[/quote]

Nah... she carefully said they can, not that anyone actually does. But if anyone has top director commissions info from the last year from Applause, I'd be happy to pass on that info in a comment. And hopefully that same issue would have top orderer info, so we could make some inferences about what's the most any director could have made...

Also, it's pretty messed up that she represented $50/week income as if that were low end. But in the same article, the DSA representative (and we know her bias) told us that the median direct sales income was $2400/year. That's less than $50/month, and that's median for (I'm almost positive) people who are still Active, and calculated based on their ordering & assuming they sold it all at full retail price.

A few years ago ONE really old n$diety earned $1 million in commissions for the year (before chargebacks and expenses, of course). There was a newspaper article about it and several of us spoiled their party by posting truthful comments on it.

The n$diety was Anne Newberry (thanks Google!) and she'd been "building her business" for 37 years before she hit the $1 million a year mark in 2006.

So, technically, Rhonda's statement is true (she just left out all the details!).

If ONE n$diety (which would be a top sales director, yes?) actually earned $1 million in a year - why can't the rest of you lazy loosers?

Could anyone who was a director share about what was you monthly bus. expenses? Just an average. My director shared last month that she sells about $600 a week and receives $3500 in comissions. Just trying to do the math here.

Oh and she called me yesterday wondering why I was returning my products. I didnt answer the phone she left a message that made me feel sick.I called the company last Wednesday. Received the form Friday and I am shipping tomorrow. Can't wait to get my check!!

Hello Cariocanut! I was a director for 2 years and some of my expenses were:

Newsletter $125 mo.
Meeting space rent $160 mo.
Prizes for consultants $20 mo.
Director Suit $400 yr.
Leadership Conf. $1500 yr.
Consultant mailing (cards ect.) $25 mo.
Special events $120 mo.
Star Consultant event $100. per qter.
Advertising $200 per month
Product giveaways $300 per month
MK jewlry $20 per mo.
Unitnet $15 mo.
Training CD's $100 per yr.
Director Meeting $50 per mo.
Additional training $200 per yr.
Fall Retreat $100 per yr.
Ordering at least $600 product each mo.

That is extremely conservative, but as you can see it adds up.

I sincerely doubt that she is selling $600 per week. If she is driving a car she may also be paying copays to MK if her unit does not do the required production.

I also hosted a director debut that ended up costing me over $1000 and I attended training in Dallas as a new director and spent about $500 for that.

I never made a dime as a director and although I did have one check at over $3000 my average per month was far below that. My sales also dropped considerably because I recruited so many of my customers in order to make director. I was extremely fortunate that I only suffered one chargeback and that cost me $350. When directors talk about their checks each month they do not mention chargebacks. I did not know about that until I had a consultant return product.

Congrats on sending back you stuff! I have never regretted getting out of MK and after only 18 months working part-time I have paid off 75% of my MK debt. I paid off 3 CC's and will have the last one paid off soon. Amazing what a steady pay check will do for you! Hope that helps.

Oh my goodness, Chop!

I couldn't decide what to do with my MK business cards. So I decided not to let them go to waste; I penned "pinktruth.com" in Bold letters across EVERY ONE of them (300+)and I'm leaving them all over the city.....Bookstore, coffee shop, grocery store, nail salon, convenience stores. I feel like I'm planting "truth seeds".

I couldn't decide what to do with my MK business cards. So I decided not to let them go to waste; I penned "pinktruth.com" in Bold letters across EVERY ONE of them (300+)and I'm leaving them all over the city.....Bookstore, coffee shop, grocery store, nail salon, convenience stores. I feel like I'm planting "truth seeds".

Chop wrote:

[quote]Newsletter $125 mo.
Meeting space rent $160 mo.
Prizes for consultants $20 mo.
Director Suit $400 yr.
Leadership Conf. $1500 yr.
Consultant mailing (cards ect.) $25 mo.
Special events $120 mo.
Star Consultant event $100. per qter.
Advertising $200 per month
Product giveaways $300 per month
MK jewlry $20 per mo.
Unitnet $15 mo.
Training CD's $100 per yr.
Director Meeting $50 per mo.
Additional training $200 per yr.
Fall Retreat $100 per yr.
Ordering at least $600 product each mo.
[/quote]

You forgot a couple things....

Unit Support Package every quarter $17-$25 each
The "First" Look Books to all of your unit members ($'s depends on the size of your unit)
Career Conference...$250.00
My rent was $260+ $70.00 every 3 months for supplies- napkins, toilet paper, paper plates, forks, spoons, knives, coffee, coffee filters, glass cleaner, paper towel, garbage bags, sugar, creamer, tea bags, ect...
Saturday make-overs the "WE" the SD's had to bring a dish approx $7.00
Demos for display at center for new and LT ED products about $75.00
Just stamps alone was about $146.00
Assistant $42-$56 a wk
Ink cartridges for printer and paper $200 yr (probably more)
MK CD's...(Depends on how many you need for you or consultants)
**If you have young children like me...
Babysitter...$7 hr x4 hrs=$28 -$28x3days= $84 -$84x4wks=$336 mo
(some weeks were more then 3 days)


Did any of you get pushed (insisted) on having a house cleaner, too?

If MK is the perfect answer for the economy then I was a little surprised when I got my email beaut-e thing from my friend (still a PU consultant)
It was begging for recruits! ...before any products were highlighted! "Discover how to turn products women love into extra income"
Sounds desperate to me

wow that is just waaay too much money. i didnt know a sd had to pay that much. im 19 yrs old and just started mary kay in feb. i came across this webpage by searching on google for nsds websites a few days ago. ive like stayed on this website since. i cant believe all of this. i feel like such a fool. everything you all have talked about is so true. my sd told me i didnt have to go to college because mary kay would bring me all the money that i needed. and so i took her advice. wow i feel sooo stupid. how do i return inventory? my fiance and my nana let me borrow around $800. i spent every last penny on inventory. my family tried to talk me out of signing but i did anyways. i guess i am naive like my nana told me. shes right, i do have a lot of growing up to do

oh and my recruiter is now trying to recruit all of my friends! how can i talk them out of it before they get in too deep like i did? because they are all just as excited as i was. thankfully i never recruited anyone.

oh and curiously pink, thats a great idea on the business cards. i was wondering what to do with mine too. and all of my samples and magazines. and all of the other crap i have wasted money on!

"Did any of you get pushed (insisted) on having a house cleaner, too?"

If they did, blame Mary Kay Ash, because she advised it in her book, Miracles Happen:

"Let me give you one piece of good advice. You can't afford NOT to have a housekeeper...stop spending dollar time on penny jobs."

Look, that director may pull down a few extra bucks in commissions because she went out and emotionally manipulated a few women in her "dollar job", but now she's the proud owner of a penny household, one maintained by maids, childcare providers...anyone but that director. Family second, career third, indeed.

NSD Pam Shaw has a cringeworthy list of tasks that her maid/Grand Vizier carries out. In addition to basic cleaning, those tasks include:

- Doing laundry (Shaw specifically instructs her to "Keep loads going all day."
- Pulling weeds
- Cooking
- Clean the garage DAILY
- Cleaning the car
- Run errands, make deposits and deliveries
- Clean Shaw's son's room with him when he gets home from school and give Shaw reports on any of her son's happenings at school. Oh yes, and don't forget to pick up his dirty clothes off the floor and iron the clean ones.

I hope Shaw's son gets that maid a very nice Mother's Day card this year.

Oh Scrib...is that for real? My Lord...have the maid "report" on the son's daily activities?

I wonder how she can stand to be so important.

Newtopink - the samples, etc. that u can't return - u can donate to a women's crisis shelter. That is what I did.

The lovely platnium compacts - I didn't give back to MK. I gave them to a shelter like that. Planting trees is a good cause, I understand. But since I was losing money on what I had, I felt it better to go to women in need - along with the eyeshadows and applicators and blushes.

Maddening what this company did by changing the compacts, etc.

Thank you ruby slippers. Great idea

NewtoPink - no, you're a smart girl not to continue in the pink fog. You listened and learned -- very fast!
Look around the website because there are detailed instructions on how to return your product. This website is awesome.

Our perspective here at PT for the most part is motivated not by the possibility for "extra income" in Mary Kay. It is motivated by the FALSEHOOD told in Mary Kay. It is motivated by carefully crafted persuasion techniques to not necessarily lie overtly, but lie by omission. You are told enough to "assume" the rest. When Ms. Shasteen presents the opportunity has something to add a little extra income, she ISN'T telling that you will be pressured to buy "star" level inventory, that you will have meeting dues and event costs, and section 2 and be mostly on your own to self train. She isn't telling you that likely you will NEVER see a profit, because summary sheets intentionally do not have places to list real expenses. SHe isn't telling you you will undergo Mary Kay manipulation to acquire Mary Kay math, which is carefully crafted to dupe the unsuspecting new prospects at meeting. She isn't telling you that those Directors parading at guest events with their "high check" are telling you something that may have happened ONCE, decades ago, and in no way reflect actual earnings. But you are manipulated into assuming these checks are monthly. You wont catch on for years. About the 70th time you hear, "And my top check without personal sales was over 8,100.00"...you figure out that hey, she has never gone over that amount in ten years!...the lights go on.

Mary Kay is great at selling the potential not the reality. If guests at events or reading the paper knew the AVERAGE profit income of the top 20% of consultants, they would realize how poor their "chances" are of making money...and the REALITY of the condition that 80% of the bottom tier are in.

Directors are considered top 2%. OF THE TOP 2 %...less than 2% OF THAT!! make over 50K BEFORE expenses.

98% of the TOP 2% make much much less. That is why those rehearsed guest event figures are hogwash and misdirection.

Now ask yourself, what kind of woman do you have to be, to CONTINUE with the scam, duping the next generation of prospects, by withholding the full story, hoping their assumptions will do your dirty work?

Welcome, NewtoPink! At least you're learning this within months of joining mk - I stuck it out for 5 1/2 years trying to make it work and thinking I was the only one who "didn't get it"! LOL! At the top of the page is a tab called Return Inventory. Check it out!

The reason I mention this, is because the new recruit prospect will tell themselves that they COULD be in that top 2% if they just worked harder than the mediocre middle. Upon GETTING to the top 2%, the Promised income just isn't there...so all those promises and assumptions made land you squarely in the hamster den where now, you must run the wheel, racing to stay ahead of attrition, recruiting a minimum of 5 new, every month, to stay DEAD EVEN.

Your sales appointments become nothing more than a bait and switch appointment to get to the REAL POINT...RECRUITING HER!

You need to recruit her to keep your unit afloat, but you LOSE all her potential leads and referrals if you do, cause she will have them.

BACK AT ZERO, LADY. You start over again. She does her Ruby star, you take a sigh of relief with half your production in, and then start your production pulling calls for the rest...and live to do it another day.

Sound like a fun job? See why Directors don't "hang" with unit members? Think anyone would want this job if they knew what happens after you buy your suit???

See why Mary Kay is fighting the FTC on the "full disclosure" issue?

Too much coffee. Sheesh :s

Never made my point. In other words, it is disingenuous for Rhonda to pretend that a million a year is anywhere near a reality...and it is EQUALLY disingenuous to allow interviewers to ASSUME that women are making money in MK at levels that would offset recessionary declines. It is HOGWASH and she knows it.

What IS Happening is that newbies buy 1800 to 3600 worth, sell a bit, pull off their 40% commission on a summary sheet, make what they think is a pitance profit, do it for a few months, pay to go to the next event..maybe two or three, order more...order more to win a charm or pin, order a travel tote, a jacket, set up an office, and never count those as expenses, because their so called money management paperwork doesn't list anyplace for REAL BUSINESS EXPENSES, and the net of the net is, they are losing money like a sieve in complete abject ignorance of normal accounting practices.

They PLAY Mary Kay business. And any person who points this out to higher ups (yours truly) is termed "negative".

Mary Kay is suckering women worldwide for wholesale orders that will never turn into profit dollars, they are simply emptying their warehouse into yours.

Rhonda Shasteen's a dunce . . . I'm just saying

Newtopink, there is a thread on the discussion board right now that addresses your questions. And many of us are much older than you and got hooked and reeled in as you did. It is not your youth that is the problem. It is the lies and the manipulation that "successful" Mary Kay women are trained in and have perfected that is the root of the matter. Perfectly coiffed sharks swimming among us.

Mycomfortzone, I love the post about how to fix the economy. Touche! Especially this: [quote]
If more money is needed, have all members of Congress and their constituents pay their taxes... [/quote] Ain't that the truth!

Something else you can do with leftover product is to call your local school district. In this economy some of them have "stores" with gently used prom dresses for girls who maybe cannot afford to go to prom or dances otherwise. I am sure to be able to get some of the makeup would be wonderful for them. Also some of your local food banks have clothing banks for women trying to get back into the job market and they can also use some of the product. Contact them to find out their needs.

Warning - If you think you can sign up with Mary Kay "just to make some extra spending cash" think again. When I discovered that I would never become a Director without putting in more than 60 hours a week, I decided to give up and just service my customers when they needed reorders. I ended up having customers who would order 1 item every few days, and many times the shipping cost ate my profit and I ended up losing. If someone ran out of an eyeshadow, it cost me $3.25 + tax on retail value + $9.00 for shipping. You still have a quota to maintain if you want to get your products at the discount. You must order $200.00 worth of product every two to three months, and someone always wanted something I didn't have.

Cousin Punchie, yes I was encouraged to hire a housekeeper as well as an office assistant as a new director.

I was told to book an extra SCC to pay for them! Extra, I had trouble booking period!

Welcome all the new posters!

Newtopink, don't feel to bad. It took me 5 years to see the light.

Raisin, girl tell us how you really feel. I do appreciate all that you contribute. I would pay money to see you debate dear Rhonda!

Raisinberry, the wording used in Shaw's document is, "Have I communicated all loose ends, anything about xxxx's school, car, or other incidents with Pam...?"

Communicated, reported, raised the guidon, puffed some smoke signals, same same.

Last line in Shaw's 2-page house management checklist:

"A fair question: Am I honestly working productively right now and giving my employers my very best effort of excellence?"

Dude, she's running your house.

Newto pink
Welcome. You are a smart young woman to have figured out so quickly what a scam this company is. On the left side of the website are informational categories you should check out. Also, after you return your product, could you click on the product return link on the right side of the page and report that figure? As far as your friends are concerned, we own them the best we have of ourselves. You are thoughtful and intelligent and really have an obligation to share your truth with your friends about what you have discovered. Directors are quick to spot enthusiastic, impressionable, eager young women because they think they are easier to delude. You certainly proved them wrong. Tell your friends and tune them in the PT.

Personally, I don't know anyone who can afford to buy MK products and I live in a middle class area. Most of the people I know go to Walmart or Walgreens for their beauty products including myself and family. Their selection of products and quality are fantastic. Walgreens has an excellent eyeliner pencil for 99 cents by Artmatic. Also, Wet n' Wild and Jordana brands are very reasonable and great quality. Selling Girl Scout cookies in my neighborhood was impossible when my daughter was in it. Besides Pepperidge Farm cookies are so much better and you can buy them almost anywhere. Direct selling would be profitable on Mars or another planet. Sorry if I am opinionated, but I've got some years of experience in the real world.

I was a personal assistant to a director prior to joining her unit, so I got to see it all. I saw what money came in, and what money went out. I am really surprised to see that you put out so much money. I would have never, I repeat, NEVER, have done that if I was not making the money to warrant such expenses. I was raised that if you don't have it, don't spend it.

I have been in many home-based businesses, and Mary Kay is the only one that has been able to sustain my household when needed. I have a pretty good inventory (it could be better), and I enjoy the new friendships and the tax deductions. My granddaughter loves Mary Kay because when I need to do something special and it's not in my budget, and they know I don't go into my savings, I just sell some product.

I make a very nice income on my 9 to 5, and since my children are grown, I need the additional deduction that a home-based business brings.

Ladies, it's a choice. You have to be strong enough to say "NO." I know it is not all roses out there and I have experienced some of it, but, you have to decide what works best for you.

I am currently a DIQ. I decided to do this because my team needed leadership. No, we don't agree with our director because she's teaching on theory. She is not in the field like we are. My team is dedicated and they know that I will never pull the wool over their eyes. I am very transparent with my business, and always will be. If there is something lurking, I must tell them I don't want them to find out second hand and then they are angry with me.

I have been in the legal profession for many, many years. I remind them what's legal and what's not. In addition, most of my team is in the legal profession as well. So, once again, it's a choice.

I understand there are a lot of disgruntled consultants out there, but, you are over 18 years of age and can make an intelligent decision. My daughter and I have a great time selling Mary Kay and are booked into the summer with weddings, etc.

I wish you all the best of luck in whatever endeavor you decide to venture into, but, remember, you have to make the choice when it is your business. Don't take on the other person's lifestyle if it is not yours.

Have a blessed day!

[quote]I am really surprised to see that you put out so much money. I would have never, I repeat, NEVER, have done that if I was not making the money to warrant such expenses.[/quote]

[quote]I make a very nice income on my 9 to 5, and since my children are grown, I need the additional deduction that a home-based business brings.[/quote]

If you're making enough money to warrant your expenses, I don't see how the MK tax deductions help you with your high income problem. If you're making more than you're spending, that only increases your income.

[quote]I have been in many home-based businesses, and Mary Kay is the only one that has been able to sustain my household when needed.[/quote]
Do you mean to say that you make enough to live off of from Mary Kay? No wait -- you said you have a 9 to 5 with a good income. Well, I'm sure you weren't trying to be misleading when you said that.

[quote]My granddaughter loves Mary Kay because when I need to do something special and it's not in my budget, and they know I don't go into my savings, I just sell some product.[/quote]
Just like that, huh? You decide to sell some product, and boom, a customer who wants something just appear. Is that it? 'Cause that's pretty much how you just made it sound...

But I'm sure you didn't mean to sound that way. Any of us should have enough sense to realize that in order to sell, you have to spend some time on the phone ignoring your granddaughter, and some more time away from the house giving a party or something, leaving her at home because it wouldn't be professional to bring her. But yeah, I get how she would appreciate that she gets more stuff when you do that.

[quote]You have to be strong enough to say "NO." I know it is not all roses out there and I have experienced some of it, but, you have to decide what works best for you.[/quote]
That's exactly right. And here we are, helping people get the information they need to make those decisions. Because when I was in Mary Kay, there was no where to find any information other that what the experts (your SD and SSD, who stood to gain from your orders) told you. And without that information, it's inhumanly difficult to stand against that experise and authority and make the decisions that are right for YOU.

[quote]I have been in the legal profession for many, many years. I remind them what's legal and what's not. [/quote]
FYI, "legal" is not a synonym for "ethical".

[quote]My daughter and I have a great time selling Mary Kay and are booked into the summer with weddings, etc.[/quote]
Super for you.

No one in my neighborhood was interested in having MK make-up for their weddings. And typically, getting brides' contact info gets pricey. I did talk to a couple people interested in an MK makeover for their daughters' proms. But it turned out there was someone else more convenient who could do it for them (since there was about 1 MK rep for ever 2 blocks there), so that didn't pan out either.

Since we are talking legal and ethical - most states will not allow you to touch your clients with any type of cosmetics or cosmetic utensil without a cosmetology license. So booking wedding and prom appointments gets dicey, because the girls want someone to "do their makeup." Not show them how to do it on the day they are nervous and do not want to have to worry about it. It's misleading to call them facials and makeovers - really, it's more of a consultation, or *gasp* a sales appointment. Ah well.

Here's something amusing I received today: How many women do you know who pay to work?--especially in the summer time when their school age children need supervision? Their expenses with child care and extra nights eating out because they are too exhausted to shop and cook bulk and car expenses... They actually don't bring home much money or maybe none at all after their expenses are taken out. Tell them about the opportunity of working from home. Mary Kay could possibly give them more time with their children and still make the money that they need to meet their family financial goals. As NSD, Linda Toupin says; "it's all about choices"

As if the women in Mary Kay make enough to work full-time at it. I can assure you, my husband was complaining about how little he saw me when I worked my Mary Kay business full time.

I was just about suckered in to becoming a consultant, then, I went to orientation and picked up my starter kit.

I had NO idea that I would have to purchase at least $600 worth of inventory before getting started......what was the $108.00 starter kit for, then ????

I am unemployed and living off of unemployment checks. How could I POSSIBLY come up with $600 to buy this stuff ???

I was really excited about selling because I am extremely bored sitting at home.

While reading the material, I noticed that they have loans and credit card websites listed for you to get further into debt to buy the stuff !

I guess I will keep the cosmetics that I will use and sell the rest on ebay or craigslist !

Glad I found this site because I was really bummed about not having the money !

And do you really wonder why Pam Shaw's office assistant/nanny to T./housekeeper/"girl everyday"/right arm/slave woman just one day up and quit?

"My team is dedicated and they know that I will never pull the wool over their eyes..."

It's not the team I'm worried about.

[IMG]http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z227/sportica/recruitme-1.jpg[/IMG]

$100,000 Question: If you need one more body to complete DIQ in the next 24 hours, is it still "all about her" and "meeting her needs?"

Dear MK Success, did you say that you are a DIQ? Come back after you reach directorship and maintain a unit for 2 years and then we will talk. Until then you can only speak from a consultant's experience and with all due respect do not know what you are talking about.

In MK, you fake it till you make it. You spend money to make money. That is what they train you to do. Also if your unit fails to reach the $4000 required production 2 months in a row you are out on your sorry rump. So many directors order product not needed in order to hold on to the unit they worked so hard to build.

How impressive that you assisted a director! You saw what she wanted you to see. We are trained to do it that way. Unless you have walked in a director's shoes, please do not come on here and preach to us about the expenses of running a unit.

You are absolutely correct that I am able to make an intelligent decision. I returned product and slammed the door and have lived happily ever after.

One last observation honey, in MK you do not make the choice, it is made for you. MK decides what you sell, MK decides quotas for promotions, MK decides quotas for cars, MK decides when, how and where you will advertise, MK decides what will be promoted on your website and in the Look Book. They can also send recruiting info without your knowledge to your best customers cutting your profit from 50% to 13% or less. MK can terminate your consultant agreement at any time they please. You tell me Ms. Success, who decides?

By the way, why don't you do us all a favor and post your 1099 and while you are at it, list the director your worked for expenses and income. Tell me how you plan to grow a unit without spending. Please Ms. Successful DIQ I would love to learn since I was such an idiotic dunce that failed because I did not know it was my choice!

Chop on that for a while, would you?!

Dear Jilthepil, please continue to read on the discussion board. It is loaded with info and it will continue to confirm you in your choice to flee MK! Congrats to you for recognizing it for what it is, a money pit.

Wow, I just realized that I haven't posted since 2007!

The Pink Person I know, has the house cleaner, babysitter(s) etc. She has 2 small children and they are with babysitters ALL the time. Sometimes there are 2-3 different sitters in one day!

The oldest could not pass pre-school twice and had a very hard time learning to talk. She spends very little time with her children, even the new baby. I cannot understand this at all. These are the most important developmental years of their little lives.

She no longer has the pink Cadillac. How on earth does she keep this going? I've observed for a little over 3 yrs. now and there is definitely a constant turn over of women.

She is extremely materialistic, superficial, lies all the time, and is very very covetous of what those around her have. It drives me crazy how she stalks women and is so uppity and arrogant as if she is above everyone else around her.

I agree with Chopportunity about supporters posting their 1099. If you did so well, prove it. I'd be happy (and so would the rest of us) to show my profit/loss statement. When I turned in my tax paperwork, my accountant shared with me, that in the 19 years she's been doing taxes, she has had over 100 Mary Kay consultants as clients, and NOT ONE of them has ever turned a profit. EVER. She of course didn't divulge names or $$$ specifics, but she did share with me that she was glad that I returned product and was not going to be "investing" anymore.

I wish that I had thought to speak with her BEFORE I signed up.

This probably isn't a bad strategy - talk to a tax professional before you make the MK leap.

I agree with Chopportunity about supporters posting their 1099. If you did so well, prove it. I'd be happy (and so would the rest of us) to show my profit/loss statement. When I turned in my tax paperwork, my accountant shared with me, that in the 19 years she's been doing taxes, she has had over 100 Mary Kay consultants as clients, and NOT ONE of them has ever turned a profit. EVER. She of course didn't divulge names or $$$ specifics, but she did share with me that she was glad that I returned product and was not going to be "investing" anymore.

I wish that I had thought to speak with her BEFORE I signed up.

This probably isn't a bad strategy - talk to a tax professional before you make the MK leap.

jilthepil, contact www.touchofpinkcosmetics.com They are liquidators who will buy your unwanted MK crap from your starter kit for 50% of wholesale. They buy lots of section 1 items, may be buying section 2 items (not sure, so ask them) so you can sell all of it at once. There are currently 26,000+ MK auctions running on eBay, where you will end up selling a lipstick for 99 cents (plus listing, plus packing supplies, plus postage.) It's not worth your time. Sell off everything ASAP and donate anything they won't buy to a HS or Jr. HS theatre department, which will be glad to take them.

Your recruiter was just stupid and/or desperate to ambush you just to get a new recruit. They used to see if a woman had credit, or was well off enough to place consistant orders, but now they recruit everybody just to try and find one who will stay with it for awhile.

Plain evil and stupid and unconscionable to recruit someone living on unemployent compensation.

MKSuccess-Don't you realize that by going into DIQ, you are putting all your consultants in competition with each other. Between you and your current Director, there is going to be at least 40 consultants (assuming 20+ are in a different area. You are limiting their chances of becoming successful by recruiting their potential markets. Who are they going to sell to? I'm sure at least 1 of them will want to become a Director too. There goes another 30. People quit being people and become numbers to further your goals. I hope they told you the "real" way to become a successful Director: Push women into DIQ that you know will fail and when they miss production, they lose their unit and it rolls up to you. Not illegal, but certainly unethical.

Chop - is this true? I tell my customers that I don't recruit. And if this is done behind my back, well that makes me look like a liar. What the heck?

"They can also send recruiting info without your knowledge to your best customers cutting your profit from 50% to 13% or less."

Hey ladies (and gentlemen)!

Haven't poked my head in for a while, but I just had to tell you about something that happened to me this weekend, and this post is so appropriate.

My husband and I went yard sale shopping this past Saturday and stopped by a fairly large sized Estate sale. The house was a simple brick ranch that had a "For Sale by Owner" sign out front. As we entered the through the living room a nice 60ish year old lady was directing us "everything in every room is for sale - just follow the signs for prices. Oh, and we are negotiable on almost everything!" Great! I was excited. I was going to find some real bargains for my Ebay business She went on to let us know that the house and the belongings belonged to her daughter who was at the hospital with her granddaughter while she had minor surgery. She said her daughter had to be "out of the house" by May 7th, so everything "had to go".

I made my way to the master bedroom where there was sign stating that everything in the closet was $1 AND negotiable. On one of the wire shelves was nothing but Mary Kay bags - black bags, pink bags, big, little, you name it. It was then that the light bulb went on... this lady's daughter was in Mary Kay! I picked up several of the bigger ones and was ready to pay the full price asked. The lady said she would take less, but I told her no, her price was fair. She confirmed what I had suspected - her daughter was "very big" into MK, but "unfortunately, things just never got started for her..."

I inquired about the house, if they had any nibbles. She said no, and that her daughter and son-in-law would probably have to "walk away". You see, he lost his job and she couldn't "make it" on what she was making. They are doing fine, she said, but they HAD TO downsize. I thanked her, my husband paid her a few dollars extra to help out, and we left.

Even typing this out I have a heavy heart for this family. I can tell by the bags, the more than one pink dress in the closet, pink shoes, formals, etc. that this woman probably bought into the "dream" big time. And where did it get her! I don't know this person and yet I'm angry at MK all over again! This woman, who was "in" Mary Kay couldn't even keep her house! I'm sick to death of the Pam Shaws and Linda Toupin's and their "just get a housekeeper and you can be a big girl too" crap

I'm so ready for this company to go down with the likes of GM and Fannie Mae! Sorry for the rant! MK sucks!

Shabby

I noticed that at my first weekly meeting, there was mostly older black women.

I think the company preys upon poor, uneducated women by telling them all of the lies !

Ok, there is so much hype to recruit.....if the entire world become consultants, isn't the market dominated ????? Who would they sell to ???

DUH......................

MkSuccess-I just want you to know you haven't got a chance. I applaud your determination to be ethical, but you need to know upfront that the "system" that is MK will eventually require your people to sit under OTHER DIRECTOR'S teaching. Sooner or later, as a Director you will be faced with the choice to be self serving or other serving. Losing your unit will hang in the balance. You will then experience the creative rationalization that typifies Mary Kay. Survival.

If you recruit an unattractive woman with a speech impediment-selling her a 3600 wholesale, you are being unethical.
Tell yourself all you want that its up to her to make it work--but if even your sharpest consultants are still selling $100 a week and ordering 600 a month..the net of the net is they are losing money, and you are baiting them.

I hope you can finish DIQ with bonafide team members, but I have lived long enough in the Mk world to know that you will find yourself face to face with your demons come the last day of the month.

And then every month end thereafter. You have no idea what the journey...or the pressure holds.

Chop..i have debated Rhonda across the diner table. I thoroughly enjoy her. I think however she is as fogged as the upline and wannabee's...at least outwardly. Who knows what she really believes. Look how many Directors are pretending they are successful in MK! Sooner or later you figure out that there aren't a whole lot of impressions that are accurate in MK.

Rubyslippers, they sent a beaut-e-news letter to all those on InTouch that have email and it had an article in it about the MK opportunity.

If your customers are on your InTouch website and they have email and did not opt out, they receive the newsletter MK sends.

Yet another example of how it is MK that runs your so called business. It should be left up to the consultant if she wants to give her customers recruiting info.!

It proves the point that MK is about recruiting not sales.

shabby..i too got "the housekeeper" because the various uplines said so. It was great! Until I wanted her social security number for my tax return...in which she went balistic! I said to her--"I paid you all year...its a business expense!!" And she said,"I would have never done this all year if I thought I would have to claim it!" My upline told us to find someone who would work cheap...and in predictable Mk style, failed to help us understand tax ramifications. I just love learning the hard way in Mary Kay!

Dear MK Success I apologize for reacting to your post in such a hostile way. My advice to you is please read through this site before completing DIQ. It may save you alot of money and heartache.

You wrote that it is about our decision but it really is not. Success in MK is about the decisions others make.

Appointments hold when others decide to come. Sales are made when others decide to buy and so often they buy the one thing you do not have or was not in your last order just placed. So you must order more, pay more shipping for one lousy item. Consultants decide if they want to book and hold appointments and how much product to order. You have little control over that. Yes, you can motivate them with prizes and pep talk but in the end it is up to them and how much credit they can get.

You have no control over consultants quitting and sending back product thus causing you a chargeback. You are at the mercy of your customers, team members, potential recruits and your sales director and of course MK. Please keep all that in mind as you pursue this so called opportunity that is based on your decisions.

Hey Shabby, nice to see you!

What you shared is heart breaking. It just makes me so sick and angry!

Thanks for sharing. We have a lot of newbies surfing the site and that should open alot of eyes. So nice hearing from you.

Raisin,
Did not know that you knew Rhonda. Very interesting! I would love to see a live debate between PT and MK. You write like an excellent debater! All I can say is that I am glad to be on your team.

Seriously, I do believe that the info. that you take the time to post has revealed the truth to many surfing this site. Thanks for all your time and effort. Hugs from Chop!

MKSuccess,
Continue On in your MK career. You deserve everything you are going to get.

[quote]I make a very nice income on my 9 to 5, and since my children are grown, I need the additional deduction that a home-based business brings.[/quote]

I suggest you go talk to a tax specialist. If you are steadily LOSING money at Mary Kay (or any home-based "business" so you can get more back on your taxes, you are a prime target for an audit.

Have a good accountant do a "what if" on your income and see "What If" you stopped the Mary Kay charade: would you have more spendable income even though you paid more taxes? That's something Mary Kay doesn't tell you - a business expense is not 100% compensated for by what it does to your taxes. To get an extra $4,000 on your refund you need to spend way more than that on businsss expenses.

MKSUCCESS: What choportunity said......

Been there, done that, got the pictures, trinkets, ribbons, cc debt to prove it.

It is not worth it.

The whole "big girl" thing in MK really pisses me off.

MKsuccess, I'm sure you are determined to make a "legal" and transparent go of things. However, the longer you are in, your principles get chipped away and it's so warm and fuzzy and subtle. Save your money for your future because MK will rob it right out from under you while making you absolutely thrilled about it with their cheap trinkets. Do be the intelligent and smart person we are all sure you are most capable of being and heed what we're all saying.

Oh Pinksedition, have you lost your big girl panties? What a lazy looser!

i hate the "big girl" thing too. it makes me feel like they're treating us as if we were toddlers trying to be adults.

MK Sucess: I really wish you well in you endeavor, and I hope it all works out for you. If it doesn't, please come back to PT, we aren't the negative, hostile group of women we come off as being in the posts.

We really want folks to succeed, we just don't feel it can be done in MK. You seem to be a decent person, I say go for it! But you know where we are if you need us.

MKSuccess- A smart person learns from their own mistakes, a wise person learns from other people mistakes.

Take all of our words to heart and know that you are heading down a path that will not help you in any way. When you are finished with MK you WILL be in debt, you will have lost friends, you will have lost respect from others, and you WILL have wasted time and energy in a company that is nothing more then a ponzi scheme disguised by pink ribbons and wolves who say they are Christians. :s

What a fantastic statement, IlikeRed! And so true. We are a consumers' advocate group, and our advice is free! Learn from us!

duped- thanks, ya know I wish I had someone tell me about MK before I first signed up. I would have never done so had I been given the facts about the company. Sometimes I think someone should call Dr. Phil or some other talk show to shed national light on just how MANY women are losing money with MK. With the economy the way it is I'm sure a lot of people would be very interested in knowing about what their friends and family member have gotten themselves and their credit into.

[quote]I wish I had someone tell me about MK before I first signed up. I would have never done so had I been given the facts about the company.[/quote]
That is our great accomplishment at PT. When I was first signing up, I tried to do a little research on the internet. I did searches for "Mary Kay", "Mary Kay Cosmetics", "Mary Kay Pyramid", "Pyramid Scheme", and I could not find one thing about Mary Kay that did not make it look good. Back then, even PyramidSchemeAlert was saying that Mary Kay seemed to be harmless.

Now, most of those searches will turn up PT on the first page, and PyramidSchemeAlert has better knowledge about Mary Kay as well.

Yeah, us!

Yes, Rachel! Thank God for PT!!!!

Chop! Congrats on being so close to getting rid of your debt! What a huge accomplishment. You go, girl!

Actually, ILikeRed, [url=http://drphil.com/shows/show/1250]Dr. Phil's show today[/url] did discuss people who were sacrificing their families' financial and emotional well-being by pursuing their "dreams." Very similar.

comfortzone,

You are hilarious, and those ideas sound great to me!

Scrib,

Love your one more body! That's what we all feel like after we get out of the MK "business", too!


I was in the store the other day, stopped a couple of ladies to ask them an opinion on a dress, and the younger of the two got me engaged in hair and make-up before I knew what was going on. She said something about me helping out my daughter with make-up for an event, and I said maybe I would help...that I had been in MK at one time. Fortunately, this shut her down, as I quickly added that I had a past recruit in my family. She actually said that that was great for one of her MK sisters to get a sale, or something to that effect. Close call! I will have to say that though she had been moving in for the kill, she backed off as soon as she knew there could be another MK lady in the picture. Never accuse me for not giving credit where credit's due.

Good article! Just stating the obvious, right? MK doesn't make anyone but corporate any large amount of money. There are SO many other real jobs around, and when you spend 40 hours on ANY other job (besides MLM's that is) you have something to take home for it.

Scrib,

What I meant about the one more body, is that we feel like all the life has been taken out of us by the time we leave MK. :s

Хороший пост, прочитав пару книг на тему всё таки не взглянул со стороны, а пост как-то задел.

Somebody translate please!

It says "I am a spammer" in Russian.

I'm not Russian, but I play one on TV!

Loose translation via Babelfish:

"A good post, after reading the pair of the books at the theme all after all it did not look from the side, but post somehow the reserve..."

(grabs 800mg Motrin, lies down)

Care to elaborate on that one Scribbler?

What are you, one of those Russian wrestler babes?

[quote](grabs 800mg Motrin, lies down) [/quote]

Scribbs, are you sure that was motrin?

[IMG]http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/trashlady25/Snoopy.jpg[/IMG]

Ура! С 2009 всех блогеров!