The Mary Kaybots will say you're unsupportive. They'll tell your wife that you're just "trying to hold her back," or that you "don't want her to have something just for herself." You'll be called negative. They'll say you just don't "get it."
The real truth is that you understand all too well what a losing proposition Mary Kay Cosmetics is. The failure rate in this so-called business is astonomically higher than any legitimate business. Why? Because it's more of a pyramid scheme (in which only a very small few win, dependent, of course, on all the rest to pass their money up the chain). It's not a real business in which results are reasonably correlated to your efforts.
So Mary Kay representatives must demonize those who use logic and reason to debunk this flopportunity. The Mary Kay director wants your wife to "invest" thousands of dollars in inventory, and you suggest she start with a very small order until she sees what she's selling. "Unsupportive! You need inventory to be successful! He must want you to fail!"
The husband recognizes that the family's money is going down the black hole called Mary Kay for repetitive "training" events which are nothing more than recruiting events. Between supplies, gas, postage, and a myriad of other expenses, the husband sees that after months, this "business" isn't even close to showing a profit. What happened to that "50% profit" they all bragged about? The ability to start earning money right away? The husband sees Mary Kay for what it is and questions the bottom line. "He doesn't get it! It takes time for a business to make money! You have to work the numbers! He must not want you to succeed!"
Mr. Right finds out that his wife is placing an order for a bunch of new products, even though he sees that large initial inventory order still sitting in the same place... collecting dust. Of course, the story is that she needs the newest stuff, that it will fly right off the shelf, that this product is totally different and will jump-start her business. (Or maybe even worse, she may tell him that she's "finishing star" which is a big deal in MK and something she can't miss out on!) The husband wisely suggests that she use a few catalogs to gauge interest in the products before ordering them and adding to the credit card bill and dust collectors. "You don't need his permission to run your business the way you see fit! By the time you get around to ordering, the good stuff will be sold out! He doesn't understand what women want!"
And so this story plays itself out in households around the country.Husbands seem to be in a no-win. If they see the signs (and most do, very quickly) and they don't do anything, they're headed down the road of financial ruin. If they do say something, they're demonized by the Kaybots because that's the only effective way to get women to NOT listen to the logic and reason presented by the husbands.
But husbands, you need to stand firm. Stop the Mary Kay train as fast as you can, before it ruins your marriage. Here is one reader's story:
I admit to being a little bitter when composing this but I have good reason to be. I recently filed for and completed my divorce with a 10 year Mary kay director. During our marriage I made many sacrifices believing in the Mary Kay myth that she so well propagated. I turned down jobs and promotions to raise our child to give her the 60-70 hrs per week she needed to work. I destroyed my credit so she could drive a free pink cadillac that ended up costing us $600+ per month. I at one point even joined her unit and bought inventory so she could make recruiting quotas during her DIQ. That was just the tip of the MK iceberg.
The real colors were shown however during the divorce. This self proclaimed Independent woman with a "career" that she said allowed her to work at home, make good money, and be available to raise a child is now a proven myth and warning to all who read this.
This Independent woman cannot function alone and has moved her mom into the house I gave her. (31 + yrs old and living with mommy) real independent (I wonder if this pitch is used to recruit). She often stated to her new recruits "a man is not a plan". Though I only worked part time she still depends on me for monthly support. according to her, she cannot afford clothes for a toddler, her father pays her healthcare, both water and electric have been turned off several times at the house, and there is no cable TV anymore.
Yet despite all this on review of her credit card bills (which she actually expects me to pay) She is charging Limousine rides, Hotels at career conference (held only about 15 miles from the house), $700 Mary Kay dinners, prizes for lazy consultants, $350 a month for a meeting hall, and it goes on and on. So much for "once I become a director I will start making money".
True gross incomes in MK can look nice when they show you their check in a meeting. What they are not telling you is how expensive it is to run that kind of "business". By the time you add it all up I was making more working 25hrs a week retail than my wife was as a 10 year director working 60 hours a week and destroying a family while doing so.
This story is repeated all across the world everyday I'm sure, However even in her own unit her top two people have separated from or divorced their husbands recently as well. In the last year I have grown dramatically and forgive her for everything and wish her well.
Though Mary Kay wasn't our only problem it made the little ones bigger than they ever would have been. I just hope this letter finds the right people and they get out of this scam before it is too late for them as well. Maybe had I been more pro active I may have been able to save my family.
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08 Apr 2009 01:30 | raisinberry
That was tough to read. You know, in 10 years as a Director, I never saw any business evaluations, no analysis of profitability, no accounting of any kind that came from Corporate or Our national Area. No oneever wanted to know the status of the Unit in real terms. There was only monthly production, and Unit Size. That's all that was stressed. Under unit size, there was training to get women into red jackets. There was effective inventory talk training. That's pretty much it. Everything was solved with Unit size. (I can feel all the Directors nodding even still) Never in all my years in MK did anyone open the door to really assessing what you were doing, and where you actually were. Denial was survival. Just get there! We can not look or we will not sleep at night. NOBODY talked about it and so nobody knew. You were drowning alone.
Right now there are Directors and Corporate Staff reading this post, and pretending it isn't so, rationalizing that so and so made it...so and so appears successful, while they DENY that thousands of Directors and their families are EXACTLY IN THE SAME POSITION.
Don't ask don't tell is the official fiscal policy of National Sales Directors, who rather than truly help their Directors by reviewing their business practises, prefer to spend their energy assigning tasks for sleepovers and guest events.
Honestly I do not know how they sleep at night either.
This husbands story is a bona fide testament to the greed and callousness of both Mk Corporate and their NSD's.
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08 Apr 2009 02:36 | maskedavonrep - The look on her face
I am so happy to read such an insightful post from a husband. I am an Avon rep, and as I have been pointing out on the board, Avon is mimicking Mary Kay from A-Z in recent years. Because of the risks involved, I keep my husband in the loop regarding my expenses, I leave my invoices out for him to review, I show him the products I purchase for myself (next to none,) inventory I purchase, etc. If a wife is hiding anything from her husband financially, the red flag has gone up.
One thing that is happening in my community is that many families are going through bankruptcies or credit consolidation, and now the wives DO NOT HAVE CREDIT CARDS. So no more frivolous spending.
When I explained to my Avon District Manager this is why Avon sales have dropped so steeply in our area, her jaw dropped. She could not believe that recruits no longer had credit cards to rack up debts. I told her it was unethical to be signing on new reps like this, with hardly any customers to be found, and she explained that recruiting was the only way to make money with Avon.
She said I needed to target LOW-INCOME WOMEN (aka, unmarried and receiving checks from the state) to sign up.
What a convenient way of making sure the husband is out of the picture.
Any woman reading this board needs to ask herself, "Am I 100% honest and open with my husband about my spending?" If the answer is no, you are on your way to a divorce. No ifs, ands, or buts.
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08 Apr 2009 02:51 | dupedbypinkfriend
Yep, highly stressed and touted is the infamous Mary Kay "husband unawareness program", and it promotes financial infidelity.
This is a despicable company, committed to destroying families. Anyone who even dabbles in Mary Kay, knowing this, is foolish, is lying to herself, and is contributing to a company that encourages its sales force to squander their family's money for the dazzling Director's suit.
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08 Apr 2009 03:00 | vintagegold
My Mary Kay career began to "fail" when my husband refused to let me place any more "active" orders until I sold what I already had on the shelf. I was embarrassed to go to the unit meetings because the Director would think I was "lazy" and not working my business. My director kept encouraging me to place orders because I would need the "new stuff" in case anyone wanted it. When that didn't work, I kept getting calls to "help out the team's goal". It was then that I getting desperate for people to buy my Mary Kay so I started doing internet research on mind manipulation the power of suggestion so I could become a better "saleswoman". Some of these Directors have $1000.00 classes with 3 people there and I wanted to know how they did it. I found out about the "husband unawareness plan" to use at the class: A little bit of cash, a little bit of check, a little bit of credit card, and he'll never discover. Unfortunately this is also used to get consultants to order more. Husbands of Sales Directors have it the worst. If a Sales Director must maintain her position or the NSD will lose her position, the Sales Director is under a tremendous amount of pressure to "pay for her unit" if the unit fails to make production, which can mean 2 to 3 thousand on the credit card for the month.
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08 Apr 2009 04:32 | AnnaMkL - The Truth....
I have to say that there is a LOT of bad things about Mary Kay as Much as good ones, like any business you have your winners and your no so good winners, is all about the way you sell and if you are a sales person,you need to have inventory to sell, that's logic,If you open a BK you have to get burgers in orders to sell them right?It's all about your way of selling and try to sell it all, to who? anybody. it's not easy, I was a Mary kay consultant and I have plenty of director friends, I thought I could sell like they did, the facials , going to people homes, I HATE it. I hated the idea before I did it, and I hate it after I've done it. I thought I could do it beacause I needed the money. but the truth of Mary Kay is that if you don't have money to invest or you are not a good sales person. don't even waste the $100 dollars,if you like the products, do it, you can buy them for half, and sell a little to your friends and family,Don't get me wrong you can get a great life style, great commisions checks, great trips, gifts, the car, but it could all go away in a minute, that is why I don't like Mary Kay, you work so hard, you get to become a director, you get your car, you get your checks and your position, but in 2 to 3 months you can't get the production, even if you have been a Director for 20 years, you loose everything, EVERYTHING, POSITION, CAR... and you have to start all over again, With what will can a woman start after that.
[color=blue][/color][size=medium][/size][size=large][/size]
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08 Apr 2009 04:36 | raw joy
financial infidelity
Good one, Duped. That's exactly what it is, but I never heard anyone put it so succinctly.
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08 Apr 2009 04:40 | AnnaMkL - I forgot....
How can you tell someone to get in a company, tell her all the things you can get and acomplish, without telling them you can work very hard but you can loose all that work in a minute, and you will be left with all the credit card bills, the debt and trying to get credit to buy a car. because they took the car you work so hard for.
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08 Apr 2009 04:42 | windycitygal
The husbands post brings back so many feelings of my own situation trying to be a profitable MK director. My husband loved me and only twice in 9 years confronted me. I remember he panic in his face. I spouted all the pink fantasy and am ashamed to say I REALLY believed it. I just needed one more month. Finally, a set of circumstances moved me out of MK enough that I could see the lies.
I have a dear friend from MK who is still a director in the hamster wheel. Her husband left the marriage and she is trying to work the MK system. It is so sad to see. She relies on sales appointments to pay her monthly bills - she is the only one recruiting in her unit. All I can do is ask questions to help her see the crazy pattern she is living but she is blinded by pink. She works 7 days a week and 10+ hour days. How long can she keep that up? It certainly isn't glamorous.
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08 Apr 2009 05:01 | caralyntheresa723
I remember when I first started MK and my husband was supportive but he DID say that 99% of the time, people who are 'successful' have done something illegal or unethical. I thought this was an over generalized statement and said that MK says "God 1st, etc." so I believe that most (if not all) in MK would not be unethical. 10 years later I know he was right. He tried his best not say "I told you so". I never became DIQ or 'successful' in MK but I did believe everythign they said and over spent on section 2 and other things. I would see MK cars and bumper stickers and feel so bad inside like'that could be me if I only tried'. now I see those things and feel bad for the person driving the car. I told my director about pink truth before I got out officially and she didn;t comment. She sent me a long list of 'thank yous' (I think this was something done up deliberately and is how they were trained to handle PT) and now has me on her customer list. She even knows I don't buy the stuff for myself anymore either. Anyway, lots of lies.
(I was just searching for stuff on premier jewelry and found an MLM truth website and it doesn't look to me that they think that MK is an MLM. Anyone ever go there? Also there was alink to a site called pinkingshears and when i wnt there i realized i went there years ago and somehow thought it was too negatgive and blocked it out. i think it is not pro-mk but not as anti-mk as i (now) would have hoped. anyway, funny how how things change once you are seeing clearly.)
thanks for reading.
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08 Apr 2009 05:03 | triumph
The whole directorship is such a lie, it is an expense to be a director, and the income is minimal.
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08 Apr 2009 05:51 | dupedbypinkfriend
[quote]I have to say that there is a LOT of bad things about Mary Kay as Much as good ones, like any business you have your winners and your no so good winners, is all about the way you sell and if you are a sales person,you need to have inventory to sell, that's logic,If you open a BK you have to get burgers in orders to sell them right?[/quote]
You can consider yourself a "winner" in Mary Kay, if you are willing to lie by omission, because the only way to break even, if that, is to recruit, recruit, recruit. And if you give someone the truth about all facets of this "business" NO ONE IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD SIGN UP!So, are you a winner if you've sold your soul? Only you can answer that.
As far as needing inventory, that is incorrect. You can not compare Mary Kay to Burger King!
Women are used to waiting a few days for online purchases, what makes this any different?
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08 Apr 2009 05:56 | Truth Not Tears
The directors who have survived Mary Kay and still have marriages in tact... we should consider ourselves very blessed!
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08 Apr 2009 06:04 | been there
This all makes me so sad
I have someone who I love dearly that is so encased in the pink fog that she does not see how this is affecting her marriage. Being a newlywed her husband is still trying to be supportive but I have recently noticed that he is now worried about money. This is something he never did before. Her national is a very eloquent speaker and has her number and is milking it for all its worth. I almost went there and could not do it. As I have stated before MK got a few hundred from me but not my sanity. I hope my loved one sees herself since she does read this site occasionally but knowing how the fog is she is not ready to see herself yet.
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08 Apr 2009 06:29 | chopportunity The above is so very sad and that could be my husband. I agree TNT, those of us who are still in our marriage after being a sales director in MK are very blessed.
My husband is analytical by nature and I just hated his questions. My SD told me not to listen to him, that he was negative and did not understand how MK worked.
I am ashamed to say that I listened to her and not my husband. I had CC's he was not aware of and had borrowed money he did not know about. 
It made be so sick to have to go to him and confess all of this.I agree with you Raisin, it is painful and difficult to read this and to remember. I also agree with the fact that Corp. nor NSD's ever tracked real information, nor did they teach us as Directors how to do that. I never honestly measured my unit until I found PT and began listening to my hubby. Once I started tracking true sales of my own and my unit verses the cost of working the MK business the lights came on and I got out!
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08 Apr 2009 07:36 | Rachel
AnnaMkL said…
[quote] Like any business you have your winners and your no so good winners[/quote]
Welcom Anna, and thanks for your comments. But you should know that MLMs like Mary Kay have a very high percentage of losers and very few winners at all compared to true businesses. So it really isn’t “like any business”.
[quote]if you are a sales person,you need to have inventory to sell[/quote]
No, you really don’t. There are many sales businesses in which people order products that are delivered later. It does not take long to order products from Mary Kay, and people who buy things like that from catalogs are used to waiting a few days to a few weeks to get their products delivered. In truth, having inventory has very little impact on how much Mary Kay you can sell.
[quote]If you open a BK you have to get burgers in orders to sell them right?[/quote]
A fast food restaurant, where hungry people go in expecting to be fed within minutes, has a lot more urgency than a cosmetics business.
[quote]but the truth of Mary Kay is that if you don't have money to invest or you are not a good sales person. don't even waste the $100 dollars[/quote]
Having the money to invest does not help you make more. It just means you can lose more. However, you do need to be comfortable with selling the product, or it is not worth trying no matter how much you can invest.
[quote]but it could all go away in a minute, that is why I don't like Mary Kay, you work so hard, you get to become a director, you get your car, you get your checks and your position, but in 2 to 3 months you can't get the production, even if you have been a Director for 20 years, you loose everything, EVERYTHING, POSITION, CAR... and you have to start all over again, With what will can a woman start after that. [/quote]
You got that right.
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08 Apr 2009 07:53 | The Scribbler
I mentioned these quotes on the boards, but I think they're worth a mention here, too. They clearly show the garbage attitude Mary Kay culture holds towards husbands:
“At Seminar, husbands know, without being told, that they’re fifth wheels here and that their job is to be quiet and not get into trouble.”
“In general, Seminar speaks to husbands with a candor that would get another company in hot water, were the sex roles reversed. A husband’s highest function, it’s implied, is to support his wife’s career If for some reason he can’t do that, he should get out of the way.”
“One Seminar woman told a group of husbands, “Don’t put barriers in my way. Put the bags in the car.”
~ From the Fortune article “Mary Kay’s Lessons in Leadership” (author Alan Farnham)
Absolute horse shaka, people. You cannot tell me that if your husband signed on with some gloriously pink opportunity and said "Shelly/Teresa/Julie/Lisa, don't put barriers in my way. Just put the bags in the car." that you would be nothing but supportive. Bet me.
[IMG]http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z227/sportica/mkmag.jpg[/IMG]
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08 Apr 2009 09:27 | raisinberry
Scrib, you are right on the money and it is just sick. How more outdated could any "training" be? It must have been novel and cute to tell men to get out of her way. Like, aw, isn't she darling? She is gonna make some big money for Papa someday.
The condescension is sickening. Men are supposed to realize they are too stupid to know how money is made in MK...trouble is...hardly ANY money is made in MK, except the tip top pyramid dwellers cracking the whip. Those are the Hubby's that get to train this nonsense into the Newbie Men.
I honestly can not think of any level where Mary Kay functions as a rational, intelligent, forward thinking company.
They got stuck in a 1963 time warp, and used cult practices to make sure nothing changed.
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08 Apr 2009 09:48 | pinkpunch Saying the words, "You just don't understand" to my husband, about MK, still haunts me to this day!
Since I've quit, he has been gracious enough to say "I was trying to tell you" rather then "I told you so".
Gosh, I love him even more for that!! 
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08 Apr 2009 10:43 | raisinberry
punch...my husband was always supportive. He believed my national and her husband. Imagine what that does! He gets to wonder why it is that I am still making 15K a year after expenses, and I am supposed to be a top ten Director. At month end I would show him what i needed to get to the next "bonus". Back in the day, 5,000 got you 500, but 8,000 got you a 900.00 bonus. Directors..isn't this true? We would figure Our commission to see if the $400 was worth putting in the difference. Consultants do not know this. EVERY month end was an exercise in ethics and manipulation...which would win? Gee if I put just 700 on my husbands card, I get $400 more back in bonus, so the NET Difference is 300 give or take and I get 1400.oo worth of retail product!!! WOW!!! WHAT A SMART BUSINESS DECISION!!!!
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08 Apr 2009 11:01 | lightershadeofpink
Our sweet wonderful husbands who work so hard and are being deceived. My husband was deceived but thank God I didn't do it intentionally. It still hurts me to think that I didn't contribute to our family's income but actually drained a ton of savings from our accounts. How I wish I had that money now or had invested it. What a waste!
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08 Apr 2009 15:21 | Still Breaking The Basic
Lurkers, go trolling through Unitnet. You can find more handouts on dealing with husbands than on actual selling of the product.
What does that tell you?
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08 Apr 2009 17:08 | saucylady
All I know is that I apologized to my wonderful husband, after I had gotten out of MK after 14 years, 5 of those years as a Director.
Mary Kay DOES NOT ENRICH WOMEN'S LIVES!!! It may for a few, but for most it becomes a burden.
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08 Apr 2009 17:20 | RubySlippers
Ok - I looked at the Ortega-NSD website. Doesn't seem she is selling product - but is very much promoting the MK oppoortunity. But doesn't that still count as advertising and her's in on through the MK web site. Looks like the company is looking the other way on that one too.
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09 Apr 2009 04:33 | The Scribbler
NSD Ortega's pink recruiting pep talk reads like nearly everyone else's in MK: she parades the same tired points and the same liberal (and somewhat unsurprising) use of capital letters and exclamation points. HOW PROFESSIONAL!!! AND SO VERY ORIGINAL!!!!!!!!!
This is my favorite part of Ortega's recruiting sheet. It involves three choices and the potential recruit is supposed to rate her level of interest. The lowest level reads as such:
I am ANNOYINGLY intrigued. I can’t even believe I have the slightest
bit of interest. I’m in shock, so I guess I will let you call me tomorrow and I’ll give you a yes or no answer. But DON’T get too excited. I’m not even
happy about being interested but this opportunity is annoyingly awesome.
No, just "annoying" will suffice, thanks.
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09 Apr 2009 05:09 | Lazy Gardens
Scribs : The lowest level reads as such:
I am ANNOYINGLY intrigued. I can’t even believe I have the slightest
bit of interest.So she frames the question to PREVENT an honest "I'm not at all interested, bugger off" answer? She presumes that there WILL be some interest?
How very ANNOYING!
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09 Apr 2009 05:52 | Day Radiance lover
[color=blue][/color][size=medium][/size]Actually, the writer of the letter sounds more like a woman than that of a man. I do not believe men use most of "those words". Heads up
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I have a family friend who had to reveal to her husband that they were in the whole approx. 20, 000.00 about 2 years ago due to the MK dream/nightmare. And, yes to you lurkers, she is a Director and this was their ticket to financial freedom and to live the life of their dreams. I will admit that they have never been very good with their money so to become a part of an MLM was probably not in their best interest. Her Senior saw her coming a mile away and took complete advantage of her "dream" and "belief" in this company. I'm still hoping someday she will see the light and really help her family by getting rid of at least one of the things in their lives that is sucking the life out of them. I have no reason to lie, so again, to the lurkers, it's the truth here at PT for no other reason but the help others.
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09 Apr 2009 13:30 | Rachel
[url]Actually, the writer of the letter sounds more like a woman than that of a man. I do not believe men use most of "those words". [/url]
What words? I'm confused...
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09 Apr 2009 14:45 | TRACY
[quote]Oh, weird. Something wonky with the quote functionality?[/quote]
I don't think so...
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09 Apr 2009 15:33 | Rachel
Ah, I'm sure it was me. I bet I put the text I was trying to quote in the "Website" box. Really dumb.
So here's what I have to add to this thread. I showed my wonderfully supportive husband that horrible Nightline video from last night's broadcast. He encouraged me to write to them here:
http://abcnews.go.com/Site/page?id=3072379
so I did. Maybe there are husbands out there who'd like to give their contributions to the story, too...
(Okay, so I'm obsessed by this, but I don't see how we can allow a respectable news outlet to get away with spitting out a Mary Kay infomercial.)
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12 Apr 2009 14:52 | misfitdirector
I almost lost my marriage. I was a director & according to my Sr. Director. He was controlling & not supportive of my business. She said, he shouldn't know anything about what is going on. & really encourage me to place orders without telling him. He did leave & of course she felt I could really work my business without his negativity. I prayed & prayed, the day papers were served we got back together, my director was upset with me, & of course questioned everything I did after that. I was in Mk another 1yr & finally after finding this web-site I started to wake up. I prayed for God to help me with mk business, blah blah & to show me if I should get out. I think he was trying to show me for yrs before I got out. Happy ending I work a regular job & i'm married to my best friend he is wonderful. I hate the time that I ignored him & the kids. I just hope to save more women.
Thanks Pink Truth!!!
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Thank you for sharing your heartbreaking story. I've already pounded it into both my sons' heads to run 180 degrees from any girl who mentions MK or whose mother/aunt/godmother/grandmother is affiliated with this evil pseudo-company.
I wish you the best!