Facts, opinions, and the real story behind Mary Kay Cosmetics.

More on Recruiting Customers of Other Consultants

Recently we got a lesson on how to “properly” recruit the customer of another Mary Kay consultant. If you have to go through that much to justify going after the recruit, is it really ethical? Here is more on recruiting someone else’s customer. It was presented as “golden rule thinking,” but it would be more appropriate to call this “do it before I steal her from you.” These are instructions on how to technically follow Mary Kay’s rules, but be really slimy about it.

It is certainly fine to ask anyone if she has heard about the opportunity. If she has not, then suggest she discuss it with her own consultant. If she will give you the name of the consultant, you can call up the consultant yourself, and say something like this….”Hi Betty! I met one of your customers the other day, and I referred her back to you. I was wondering if you are going to recruit her? Are you building your team? (Wait for her answer)

If she says, “Nah, I am only doing reorders, don’t want to recruit, etc.” then it is okay to say, “Well if you are not going to talk to her about the company and try to recruit her, then I would like to!” That way she will know you are going to be contacting her customer.

Then, if she says, ” Now wait a minute, this is my customer, etc.,” you can say, “Don’t worry, I won’t ask her until you have had a chance to do it. I will wait 2 weeks, and in that time you can interview her and see if you can guide her to a decision. If you have not recruited her in two weeks, then I will contact her again to see if I have any luck.” This usually puts a fire under the woman, and she will interview and recruit this person that you noticed.

But, a lot of times, after the two weeks is up, the prospect STILL has not been contacted! YES, this is hard to believe, but some consultants are very complacent!

I truly believe in Golden Rule Thinking, but there are two sides to it. There are some consultants who NEVER will ask ANY of their customers to consider joining Mary Kay! That is because they are thinking that they want ALL of the 50% for themselves, and do not want any recruits or competition in their areas. It is NOT Golden Rule Thinking to never offer them the opportunity!

So, we have a choice. We can either say, “Oh, you have a consultant, be sure and ask her about the opportunity,” and then drop her like a hot potato. Or, we can take it a step farther and also ask, “Who is your consultant?” Then you can call up the consultant and ASK her if she is interested in interviewing the customer you met. Because a LOT of the time, the consultant is NOT interested in the responsibility of having a Teammember!!

We should take the time to find out!

Also, if she is interested in recruiting the lady, you can back off. If she has not been in any kind of contact with the prospect after two weeks, even with your urging that she go forward with it, then I think it is okay to talk to the prospect yourself.

I am not saying that the prospect has two weeks in which to contact her own consultant for details. I am saying you make the phone call to the consultant and if she indicates she would like to recruit her own customer, then you ask her to follow up on the lead within the next two weeks, and then if she does not recruit her, then you are going to try!

Of course, if the prospect has not signed up after two weeks, but is about to go to a MK luncheon or meeting, you back off because obviously something is being done towards getting her into the company. You back away from her if you see this happening.

Do not monkey with other people’s monkeys!! It would be terrible if you got her to go to your own meeting before the original consultant’s meeting is held, if they have an appointment. She is doing her job. Back away when you see this happening. There are plenty of prospects out there! You will get your fair share if you keep asking!

You only say that you are going to give her two weeks in which to contact the prospect if the potential recruiter indicates some interest, because she might tell you at the first of the conversation that she does not want to recruit OR go to meetings. This happens all the time. In that case, you have a green light to go forward immediately in recruiting the prospect.

Also, anytime I meet someone who is asking me all kinds of questions about the Mary Kay Opportunity, I ask them if they have a consultant. If they are quite impressed with me, they might play down their own consultant, and say something like, “She only held a class that I attended and bought something, we didn’t talk about the opportunity, or how to become a consultant.”

I say, BACK AWAY and do not get involved. Instead I say, “Well, I am sure your friend would love to be your recruiter, so it is better if you contact her and ask her about the company. I wonder if I might know her?? What is her name??? Hmm, I do or don’t know her, but please call her up and let her know you are considering Mary Kay for yourself.” WHY WASTE YOUR TIME GETTING HER EXCITED, it is the other consultant’s job to do that and bond her to the other consultant. Then, YOU CALL the other consultant using the wording above and see what happens.

If you find out the coast is clear, then you can call the prospect back and say, ” I spoke to Betty Consultant and she said she is not building her team right now, so it is OK with her for me to talk to you about the business instead of her. Let’s set an appointment to get together.”

I hope this answers your questions about how to proceed when you meet another consultant’s customer. It is okay to ask if they have ever heard about the Mary Kay opportunity, but at the same time you must get the name of their consultant and contact her first. She gets first try out of courtesy. If she is not interested in doing any recruiting then you can go forward with a clear conscience!

Of course, as the Director, I would have a fit if I found out that one of my consultants was turning away a prospect. I would hope that she would keep the prospect for herself, and then contact me the Director to do the recruiting for her. At least this way the new recruit would come in and benefit the unit!

Also, anytime there is a conflict in recruiting someone and it involves one of your own team members, you should let the new recruit go in under your team member.

This way, your team member stays happy, and will continue to work. If you keep the recruit that your team member thinks she should have had, she may get mad and just quit and then you are worse off than before.

Obviously, if your team member meets one of YOUR customers, she should follow the above procedure. She should not feel she can help herself to your or anyone else’s customers! That would not be right.

You are a strong recruiter and you can go and find another one later to make up for this one that you let go. Sometimes conflicts like this arise when you both meet the same person at the same time, or if the person was at the same show where your team member came from. If she wants the prospect, let her have her. That will pay rich dividends for you later on. This builds trust and she knows you are trying to help her.

So the bottom line is that if a consultant has a faithful customer that she is servicing but not recruiting, IT IS OKAY FOR YOU TO STEAL THAT CUSTOMER AND TURN HER INTO A RECRUIT.


  1. Char

    “So the bottom line is that if a consultant has a faithful customer that she is servicing but not recruiting, IT IS OKAY FOR YOU TO STEAL THAT CUSTOMER AND TURN HER INTO A RECRUIT.”

    ^^^^^I just had to isolate that summary.

    If it is not clear to anyone that MK is all about recruiting and not customers, aka a pyramid scheme, then I don’t know what is! If you are a MK consultant, you are a pyramid schemer/MLMer. 99% of people lose in MLM and the other 1% are the top liars and cheats. Which one are you?

    1. Mountaineer95

      Exactly! I just copied that line to mention in a comment here. If this new recruit sells the same amount of product (or rather, orders the same amount of wholesale product) that the existing recruit would have, the company makes the same amount of profit and the same amount of retail sales dollars has been achieved…so WHY would this be a negative thing for the director? Because all wholesale dollars are not equal; it’s how the levels of the pyramid order this wholesale that matters.

      1. Mountaineer95

        Exactly! I just copied that line to mention in a comment here. If this new recruit sells the same amount of product (or rather, orders the same amount of wholesale product) that the existing recruit would have, the company makes the same amount of profit and the same amount of retail sales dollars has been achieved…so WHY would this be a negative thing for the director? Because all wholesale dollars are not equal; it’s how the levels of the pyramid order this wholesale that matters.

        Edited to add, for clarity, that this is the specific line I intended to discuss:

        “If you keep the recruit that your team member thinks she should have had, she may get mad and just quit and then you are worse off than before.”

        Why would you be worse off if this new stolen recruit orders the same wholesale amount as the existing IBC from whom you’ve stolen the recruit? It’s the same amount of RETAIL sales, right? Because each wholesale dollar carries different value to the upline depending on where in the pyramid the wholesale dollar was spent. This is not a disputable issue for the Kaybots; it is plainly spelled out in the company’s compensation charts. The upline is given varied amount of commissions on the same wholesale order amounts depending on where the person placing the order sits in the pyramid structure. Which also demonstrates another FACT about the MK structure that is ridiculously denied by so many Kaybots: that the commissions are NOT paid based on sales but rather out of the goodness of the MK Corporate hearts. Out of all the ridiculous assertions made by Kaybots (and there are sooo many from which to chose), that is the one that is most absurd to me. But that’s a whole post for a different day, and from the blatant ignorance displayed by those who believe this, we cannot ever prove to them it’s false regardless of how much logic and common sense we use in explaining it.

        1. Mountaineer95

          Tracy, I accidentally copied the text of my original comment when copying the text I wanted for my reply comment, I can’t figure out how to edit it so do you mind doing so? Thank you, and I’m sorry and will proofread next time. I am ashamed to say I have a degree in English lol.

  2. Lazy Gardens

    Where/who did this “recruit them all, no matter what it does to a fellow consultant’s profits and customer base” come from?

    Because it certainly shows that it’s not about building a sustainable customer base and a solid business, it’s about clear-cutting the woodlands, strip-mining the mountains, and overgrazing the prairies. Recruit until there is no profit left.

  3. SisterHavana

    “There are some consultants who NEVER will ask ANY of their customers to consider joining Mary Kay! This is because they are thinking that they want ALL of the 50% for themselves, and do not want any recruits or competition in their areas.”

    If Mary Kay was a real business based on retailing products, this is what you’d want!

  4. PurpleH

    I had this done to me twice by directors who knew me, had my phone number and even held shared meetings with my director. No courtesy call or prompting me to recruit them – just fake smiles and excuses when I asked them about it. “Well, she said you had never offered.” Of course it turned out they did me a favour, since it helped show me what MK is really all about. The Golden Rule, Miss Go Give, blah, blah, blah – lie, cheat, scam for commission on a $600 order.

    1. coffe queen

      This is how I lost my DIQ. In fact, I had arranged for meeting some potential recruits for a coffee in the evening 2 days away (due to family, etc.) My director called them up and met with them before hand and recruited them (She told them on my behalf but in reality she signed them up under her). when I called her out on it, she told me I had to act fast otherwise I would lose them and that she didn’t like my style of recruiting (I focused more on no inventory and did not pressure my team for inventory). That is when I quit

        1. Mountaineer95

          I second that! And then we can sit back and wait for the customary grammatically-challenged personal use IBC of three months (who is making crazy sales in a few hours a week and has no desire to recruit) to show up and tell us that obviously the director in question here is one of a kind and NO other directors would ever do this and this one bad apple shouldn’t ruin the bushel and she will pray for us and….the same old same old.

        1. Coffee Queen

          I am not a writer.

          However, here it goes.
          When I started MK, I was on mat leave with my first child and bored out of my mind. I decided to take another year off work (we get a full year here in Canada). I found a bunch of ladies who were really kind to me and MK got me out of the house weekly.

          Then came the inventory question. I did not do a big star order or anything like that. However, I build my inventory slowly. If I had a customer or Ivory 3, I would order 2 of them (so that I would have it in stock) . So the first year I built my inventory slowly. I made the min orders through their skincare because I loved it.

          The second year, I had quite a few people who wanted to sign up for the discount. So I signed them up. I told them about the inventory, but also told them the way that I did it and that I was a no pressure leader. I built up a big team, and was ready to go into DIQ.

          My leadership style was so different than my director’s style and it came to a lot of her telling me I was lying and that I was too negative, I brushed it off but deep down it stung.

          So month 2 into DIQ, I had a very successful party. And 3 of the ladies were interested in signing up. We also had a contest to bring in customer cards into the monday meeting (my mistake was falling for this). On these 3 ladies cards, I had written meeting x night at starbucks. By this time, I was back to work full time and could not meet during the day.

          This director made a habit of calling customers on these cards to thank them for coming and support the consultant. She then spoke to my three potential recruits and asked them to meet earlier at a Tim Horton’s on my behalf.

          She met with them, they signed up, all without me knowing.

          When I called to confirm the Startbucks date, they said they had met with director and signed up under me. They were under the impression that I knew about it. So I faked it and said that it was fine.

          I called my director, and said that I did not receive any sign up emails, etc. This is when she told me that she signed them up under herself because i wasn’t director material, my leadership style was lacking, I needed to work on my own self before i could lead others.

          I said, “very well”. I told these three girls what happened. and I quit then and there.

          I did not send back product (I didn’t have a lot in the first place, like I said, I was smart with my inventory). What I did was donate it to a shelter, and then started doing some research on MK , found you guys and haven’t looked back.

          I have learned that the 3 girls all quit within a couple of months. One got in touch with me and said that the director was way too pushy and she would have preferred my laid back style (a vibe she got from my parties. ).

          What hurt the most (and still hurts), is that I genuinely thought that these women were my friends and that they cared about me. Turns out they cared about my wallet, not me.

          Again, not a writer and sorry if this doesn’t flow well.

          1. EyesWideShutNoMore

            Who’s area were you in? I think there’s an NSD (or more!) who encourage that bs. Do you know if that other one is still a director?

            I’m wondering if that’s how they roll in Quebec, they are churning out the new directors and NSDs!

            1. Coffee Queen

              I was in Canada, and Angie Stoker was my NSD. People treated her like a god.
              To me, she looked old and was trying too hard and wore way too much makeup and had gaudy jewelry. I’ll never forget meeting her. She was really sweet though… but all I was thinking was “Oh. Honey, you need a makeup lesson for mature skin.”

              1. EyesWideShutNoMore

                I’m in ON, and had Suzanne Felker. I never met Angie Stoker, but I agree, she was treated like a god and revered for her “what you see is what you get” ways because she’s not that educated and she was #1 for years so it’s as if she was living proof that anyone could do it.

                There was some training call on Thanksgiving that she was doing after she retired and I thought, “What the hell would she know about booking and doing parties, she hasn’t had to do one in decades…” and on a holiday!

          2. Kimisan

            That is the Anita Garrett-Roe method of rebuilding the pyramid after a DIQ becomes an SD! There is an article about it I’m sure you can find if you use the search function. So glad you got out, Coffee Queen!

          3. MLM Radar

            Wow! You were hit with a classic sabotage move.

            If it looks like you’ll finish DIQ, she quickly steals some of your recruits so she won’t lose commissions when you create your own unit.

            Hey, if you’re a strong DIQ you’ll replace them easily, right? And if you’re a weak DIQ then her sabotage will cause you to fail, and she’ll get all your recruits.

          4. SAHM_artist

            That is incredible. I recall one Director of my former high school teacher MK consultant who invited me to a class (when I was out of college). Her director looked like a dragon lady who tried to sink her claws into me.

            You’re just fine as a writer—I could feel the sting of your director stealing your girls as if it happened to me. What gall!

  5. BestDecision

    Another twist on this, which happens ALL the time, is customers that lie and say they don’t have a Consultant.

    I remember one trunk show I held where the hostess got bonus credit for every guest she had that didn’t use MK. Once I got their profile cards back into my hands, one had written a note to another instructing her to say she didn’t have a Consultant. I was furious, especially because the hostess happily took her free products and robbed me of my net profit. If only I’d seen the note before I left her house!

    See? Yet another beautiful Saturday I gave up only to end it physically exhausted and disappointed, angry, used, and not wanting to do it all over again for someone else. This is the side not one single Consultant or Director refuses to admit and acknowledge.

    1. PurpleH

      True, many customers have figured out how to get freebies from MLMers. I am pretty certain that one of my poached customers was taking advantage of me and of the Director who signed her. She had 2 facials with me, loads of samples as she was trying to choose a wedding look, and then took more samples from the director and some kind of gift for signing. I think that unscrupulous MLMers deserve the “kit-mappers” who waste their time just to get the kit and disappear.

      1. EyesWideShutNoMore

        I had one girl come to a group event and since she brought 2 friends, I gave her a hostess gift. None of them bought anything and she joined Arbonne shortly after. So, I actually was out money to buy the hostess gift which of course she picked the most expensive thing. It was a brutal night, her and her friends wore A LOT of makeup and were demanding. Burned through their colour card samples and wanted more and were annoyed they didn’t get brow pencils. (This was about 10yrs ago before brows were in). I hope she’s had a person like herself in her Arbonne efforts!

  6. Mickey2942

    This is not a business. Mary Kay is not about selling products. It is about lying to people to get them to be your cash cows. And for those people to have the same lack of ethics, to sign up more cash cows. How many cash cows can feed in one field?

  7. Roo2

    Can we talk about this NSD trip? It’s all expenses paid on a Silverseas cruise. The millions of rediculous photos and hashtags on Instagram are a hoot. But then after bragging about it being a second honeymoon, they were in a “business meeting” all day while on a sea day. How disappointing given an amazing trip for the small price of a basement full of products and sitting in a conference room watching a PowerPoint. But I can’t even imagine the qualifications for this trip and one NSD had the nerve to post her giving the spa therapists her business cards. Cringe!!*** those poor people work long hours and contracts away from home. They don’t need a Mary Kay business card!!! But that seems typical of the elevated egos these women have.

    1. BestDecision

      Go watch Pam Shaw’s posts and Stories on Instagram. Sickening how full of herself she is. She loves taking pictures of herself more than anyone I’ve ever seen. I don’t know what she’s doing to her face, but it looks scary. Cindy Williams looks like The Joker now. Way too many fillers and Botox!

      1. Roo2

        Agree! And they are flaunting around Europe thinking they are Beyoncé level it is sickening. I read an article once about how at seminar they don’t tip they leave free products and Jesus loves you cards. Cause that pays the bills.

  8. Mountaineer95

    “There are some consultants who NEVER will ask ANY of their customers to consider joining Mary Kay! That is because they are thinking that they want ALL of the 50% for themselves, and do not want any recruits or competition in their areas. It is NOT Golden Rule Thinking to never offer them the opportunity!”…

    THIS is exactly why it is indisputable that the MK Corporate focus is NOT on the IBC’s retail sales, but on recruitment. If MK truly only cares about retail sales to the (hypothetical) end consumer, then they would NEVER suggest that an IBC should willingly sacrifice her own profit dollars so that other IBCs can get in on the opportunity. Seriously, who in their right mind would be told this and think that it’s acceptible? If the product is so popular and easy to sell, as they say, then there should be such an abundance of interested potential IBCs that no current IBC should ever feel that she “has” to offer the opportunity to her retail customers. These potential IBCs will seek out the opportunity themselves for such a great chance at making money.

    1. Mountaineer95

      Often I compare the things we see here from MK to when I worked in retail sales…as a store salesperson and manager, a manufacturer’s Rep (where wholesale sales were to actual retail stores and you had to have a federal tax ID and brick-and-mortar store to purchase at wholesale, oh what a novel idea), and as an ACTUAL retail business owner. So I take the statement or spiel offered by MK and plug it into proven best practices for legit retail sales…and every time the MK crap sounds ridiculous in comparison. Such as:

      I owned a retail mattress store. I very carefully chose my location based significantly on estimated buying dollars for mattresses in that area, in comparison with existing stores. Ie, determining a market where competition was low and potential spending dollars were high. I decided on a spot and had many great, personable customers. And not ONCE did I ever take aside one of my customers to say “hey, you’re really sharp and would make a great salesperson, there’s a storefront across the street that’s vacant, you should open a mattress store there!”

      Seriously? Why would I EVER push anyone into reducing my market share and thus sabotaging my entire business? Let’s even go as far as to say that my wholesale mattress suppliers would offer me a percentage of whatever she buys from them at wholesale as a “referral” or “finder’s” fee…I could get a small percentage of her WHOLESALE orders by sacrificing ALL of the profit I would have made if I were still the only store on the block and the customers that would buy from her are instead still buying from me. The difference is HUGE. So of course no retail store owner in their right mind would agree to that. And if the wholesale suppliers would have come to me and said “you’re not sharing the opportunity!” in response to my choice to NOT sabotage my own success? That would be laughable in the legit retail/wholesale world. That wholesaler wouldn’t survive long at all if they did that; instead, most wholesalers (at least in mattress/furniture) will contractually guarantee a territory to their retail partners.

      MK not only does NOT suggest to ANY potential IBC that they should research their area to gauge the market, they also intentionally hide the stats of how many existing IBCs and above are in any given area. Because they KNOW that anyone with a lick of business sense would want that basic info before committing even $100 to an “opportunity”. And you know that directors know exactly how many existing MK sellers are in her area (because her compensation is based on it), but how many directors actually tell a recruit how much competition she’ll have? How many directors know that their area/unit is already saturated with reps and willingly share that info with the recruit?

      Sorry for the long post, but this aspect of MK really infuriates me. It makes NO practical business sense, and not once has a Kaybot ever provided a retort to this, not even a laughable one. It’s deemed ‘negative’ so they just cover their ears like a child and scream “I can’t hear you!!” when the issue of sabotaging their own market comes up here.

      Please, seriously, will some MK supporter explain in detail how recruiting your own market (and willingly, even blindly, working in an over saturated market) is financially beneficial to you? Not the hypotheticals of how much you *might* make from your supposed future downlines; but HOW MUCH profit you are making right this moment from the commissions you make on the wholesale orders made by your former customers that you recruited versus the actual profit you made off their sales when they were still just your loyal customers.

      1. JanRD

        Well said! My husband and I were franchise owners of a retail business and while there were rules to follow, they were (for the most part) reasonable. The stores were in shopping centers with multiple high-profile clients, Corporate regulated the distance between stores, When we decided to sell the business to move across the country, we were able to work directly with the new owner. Try that with MK. A consultant cannot sell her customer base (but she probably has a closet full of product)!

  9. enorth

    “many customers have figured out how to get freebies”

    One of the saddest videos I watched was of a MK SSD who foolishly recorded herself doing a real skin-care class. The class consisted of the hostess and one guest. (The others had canceled at the last minute, the hostess explained.)
    It was obvious from the start that the hostess had been through this game already. She sat silently through the SCC but, when it came time for the close, she rattled off her freebies and discounts better than the SSD! The SSD was clearly miffed. The guest bought nothing.

  10. Kelly

    Back when I used MK, one of the reasons I really liked my consultant was because she never tried to recruit me. When she moved and another friend got involved with MK, she tried to steal me from my original consultant and recruit me. Her actions severely damaged our friendship and drove me away from MK altogether.

    1. Enorth

      I watched a video made by a sales director at her weekly meeting. She said something to the effect of, “I have to be honest, about 80% of my orders are for my own use, not for customers.” (The premise was that you have to use the products to be able to sell them.)

      1. TRACY

        And how much can one person possibly use? She essentially said that she sells next to nothing to actual customers. Think of it this way: If she uses MK head to toe and that’s 80% of her orders, then she is basically selling to one customer who uses a few products.

        1. enorth

          It was an odd thing to say to her unit (well, to the three people at the meeting.) She also said they were close to no longer being a unit.
          The video was from 2017, and I suspect she is no longer a SD or perhaps has left MK. I could not determine her name.

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